[ SECRET POST #3461 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3461 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 54 secrets from Secret Submission Post #495.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

Yesterday, there was a lot of yelling about how this was the fault of the regressive left.

Can any of those anons please tell me, specifically, what they mean? what are the specific political positions that constitute the regressive left and how specifically did they lead to this outcome?

SA

[(Anonymous)]

Also, just in advance, if you refuse to explain and instead link me to a Youtube video that you say explains all your points, I'm not watching it, use your fucking words

Re: SA

[(Anonymous)]

NO! I want you to watch youtube vids, I want I want I want I want I want! YOU like in YOUtube! Pleaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaase?!

Re: SA

[(Anonymous)]

You don't deserve a goddamn thing. "Regressive left" isn't a real thing, and your insistence on using it just reveals you for the alt-right concern troll that you really are.

Re: SA

[(Anonymous)]

that's exactly what the regressive left wants you to think

Re: SA

[(Anonymous)]

I'm asking people who believe in the regressive left to explain what they think they're talking about. I really don't see how that makes me an alt-right person.

uh

[(Anonymous)]

...the fuck do those words even mean??

Re: SA

[ariakas]

I'm guessing that "regressive left" is like the "Progressive Conservative" party we used to have here in Canada.

I.e. bullshit political double-speak.

Re: SA

[(Anonymous)]

It's not a real thing. "Regressive left" is just a nonsense term one anon keeps using to whine about people they disagree with.

Re: SA

[(Anonymous)]

I mean, I suspect it's largely bullshit, but I'd like to at least get people who think it's real to give some kind of account of what they mean by it.

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not the OP, but the person making that claim yesterday posted this link to explain it?

https://www.commentarymagazine.com/articles/illiberalism-worldwide-crisis/

Admittedly, I don't really understand the whole thing? So if someone can help translate, I'd appreciate it.

Re: venting

[raspberryrain]

That sounds like a neoliberal, mayba a Tony Blair supporter, somehow trying to claim that anybody who would rebel against or disagree with the Western-neoliberal power structure is an "illiberal"--and thus sort of "the same thing"--whether old-fashioned left-socialists like UK Labour or SYRIZA, or nationalists in Hungary and Iran. It's nonsense.

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

The regressive left is the left that's so concerned with pronoun enforcement and e-triggers that it attacks people's rights in the process. I'm in America, so that's what I'll talk about: after the Orlando attack, the left's primary concerns were to deny the textual homophobia in the Qu'ran and to hijack the gun control debate with an attempt to make the unconstitutional no-fly list a principle of law.

Another example would be how the left is so busy accusing Republicans of being dangerous bigoted murders that they haven't noticed that Hillary Clinton has a body count and a war chest paid for by Saudi Arabia (world leaders in LGBT rights and fair wages, amirite?!).

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

Thank you for answering! OK, so trying to sort this out: regressive leftism is leftism that:

a) overly concerned with language use
b) attacks peoples' rights
c) is uncritical of - and defensive of - specific tribal alignments in society despite the inconsistencies in doing so, particularly Islam and Hillary Clinton

I have a few follow up questions, if you don't mind, about things that still aren't clear to me.

1) I understand you're American, so maybe this isn't relevant to me, but it's still not at all clear what the causal linkage is between this idea and Brexit.

2) Do you think that the way that we talk and think about other people and society is totally unimportant? Or just overemphasized?

3) What do you mean when you say that concerns with language lead to "attacking peoples' rights"? I'm just not sure what you mean, because it doesn't seem like it's obviously linked to the idea of language policing, and it also doesn't seem like there are any instances of attacking peoples' rights in the later examples you give, except gun control, and that doesn't seem like it has anything to do with political correctness.

4) Would you consider this a theoretical disagreement, or a tactical one?

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

1) Because the Leave campaign has been conflated to Trumpism. It's a populist uprising that's in part the result of the regressive left's authoritarianism. People rightly believe that the success of Brexit is and indication of how the US election might go.

2) Only when it impinges on other people's rights. The basis of liberalism is individual rights, which the regressive left want to strip away for the sake of the greater good.

3) If you follow media closely, you'll see many, many cases of universities banning speakers, punishing groups who invite them to campus, social media censoring posts critical of Islam or "progressive" attitudes, etc.

4) Not sure what you mean there.

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

1) Similar problems to the ones in the USA are happening throughout the EU. Poor people born in EU nations remain poor while their leadership funnels in migrants who demand that their new neighborhoods cater to their dietary, modesty and sex-segregation codes. Protesting this gets you a racist stamp. Collect ten stamps and your next thinkpiece about how white rape victims just don't understand Syrian culture is free.

2) It's overemphasized. My problem here isn't that people want to complain about video game tits, though. They can do that. The problem is that people get so wrapped up in it they start to DENY real crimes.

3) I mentioned the no-fly list for a reason: it's a shadow list you can end up on for no reason without knowing you've gotten on it until you get to the airport, which there is no consistent way to contest and - unless you're wealthy - which you are unlikely to ever get off of. It's a violation of American citizens' right to freedom of movement, and the Democrats tried to make it into an on-the-books law under the guise of gun control.

4) I don't know what you mean by this.

Wikipedia Says

[ill_omened]

"The regressive left (also sometimes referred to as regressive liberals) is a political epithet used to negatively characterize a section of leftists who are accused of holding politically regressive views (as opposed to progressive views) by tolerating illiberal principles and ideologies for the sake of multiculturalism and cultural relativism.

Within the specific context of multiculturalism, British anti-Islamism activist Maajid Nawaz used the term in 2012 in his memoir Radical: My Journey out of Islamist Extremism[note 1] to describe "well-meaning liberals and ideologically driven leftists" in the United Kingdom who naïvely and "ignorantly pandered to" Islamists and helped Islamist ideology to gain acceptance. In a 2015 video presentation on the Internet forum Big Think, Nawaz elaborated on the meaning of the term, saying that it describes "a section of the left" that has, in his opinion, "an inherent hesitation to challenge some of the bigotry that can occur within minority communities ... for the sake of political correctness, for the sake of tolerating what they believe is other cultures and respecting different lifestyles".[2]

Among well-known political and social commentators, comedian Bill Maher, Internet-based talk show host Dave Rubin and New Atheist writers like Sam Harris and Richard Dawkins have discussed the concept numerous times.[3][4]"

Re: Wikipedia Says

[(Anonymous)]

Fuck off, dick head.

Re: Wikipedia Says

[(Anonymous)]

It does seem like a lot of the narrative vis-a-vis Islam is an application of the general New Atheist attitude towards religion, where religion is considered to be fundamentally bad and wrong. Which is a little frustrating if you consider that attitude chickenshit and stupid in general.

Re: Wikipedia Says

[(Anonymous)]

I like the New Atheists even less than I like the old atheists, but they have a point about consistency. Anyone who'd acknowledge -isms in Jewish and Christian texts should be prepared to acknowledge them in Muslim ones.

Re: Wikipedia Says

[ariakas]

Personally, if I were going to criticize my side for anything, it would be the anti-science hysteria so common on the left, not some willful misunderstanding about multiculturalism that somehow not berating or arresting Muslims at every opportunity is going to wind up with everyone under Sharia law.

I mean, Bill Maher so bold and willing to talk shit about Islam despite being a liberal, wow. Much edge. Yet he's an anti-vax moron.

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

I think that was all just one anon, actually.

Re: venting

[(Anonymous)]

Two, I'm betting.

Re: venting

[feotakahari]

A Muslim created the term with the intention of focusing criticism on Muslim fanatics and people who make excuses for them. He wanted to get the crazy out of his religion, but now it's used to attack all Muslims and everyone who won't publicly shit on Islam. I'm no fan of organized religion, but I can't help but see a certain bitter irony in it.

Re: venting

[soldatsasha]

Disclaimer: I am a queer immigrant liberal socialist.

imo there's actually a big link between Brexit and the rise of Trump, and the 'regressive left'. (Though personally I prefer the term "liberal elite", since it more accurately describes their privilege and position in academia and politics.)

Liberal discourse has a tendency to veer into smug condescension and that's off-putting.

The 'regressive left' is more focused on being enlightened and sensitive than it is on actually helping people. They do stupid shit like the mayor of Baltimore giving rioters "space" to destroy (mostly black) people's homes and businesses. Or they claim that immigrants or refugees aren't criminals or don't take jobs away from native workers, even though both are categorically untrue. Note that in both these examples poor people are disproportionately affected.

And when people push back against this sort of thing they get branded as bigots, whether this is actually true or not. Because only someone who supports police brutality would speak out against looting and rioting, right? Only a bigot would call for more scrutiny towards Muslim immigrants after dozens of terrorist attacks, violent rapes and murders throughout Europe, etc.?

Now we have a situation both in the UK and the US where people who are usually moderate have swung to the far right because they're sick of being demonized or disenfranchised. Trump actually has an astonishing number of minority supporters, bc the Democratic party has totally failed to court them. (ex. Obama making the Orlando shooting about gun control, rather than Islamic extremism or homophobia) Likewise, I'm sure a lot of Brexit voters felt that way bc they thought their govt was more focused on being sensitive than it was on taking care of it's own people.