[ SECRET POST #3925 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3925 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 28 secrets from Secret Submission Post #562.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

06. https://i.imgur.com/eUIMAGV.png

[(Anonymous)]

You're not alone, OP. I feel the exact same way.

[(Anonymous)]

I have no opinions of J2 specifically. But regarding A/B/O, I'm sure lots of people know about actual wolf dynamics. "Oh my god, you mean Omegaverse isn't a highly accurate depiction of how real wolves behave? I had no idea!" said almost no one. A/B/O is a kinky fantasy. Very few people who like it are under the impression that it represents actual wolf dynamics. People just took a few little tidbits of info they'd heard somewhere about wolves and used them as inspiration to create something they found hot.

Personally, I've seen A/B/O fics where the dynamic was inspired by elephants rather than wolves. I've also seen A/B/O fics where Alphas have tentacles instead of cocks. The wolf thing is honestly pretty irrelevant beyond its initial usage as a kernel of inspiration.

You obviously don't have to like A/B/O, but just because A/B/O is annoying to you doesn't mean others' enjoyment of it is stupid or harmful.

[(Anonymous)]

"I'm sure lots of people know about actual wolf dynamics"

Oh ... oh I wish they did

[(Anonymous)]

Almost no one who writes or reads A/B/O actually takes it seriously, it's *crackfic*

Anyone who thinks A/B/O fans are unaware of the silliness of what they're doing...I don't know what to say to that. But people who are having fun doing something stupid aren't always doing it because *they're* stupid.

[(Anonymous)]

Ayrt, and yes, I completely agree. Like, do tons of people believe that wolves have alpha males that lead their pack and all the others are betas with no power, and that's how wolf packs work? Sure, lots of people believe that. But I bet my bank balance that A/B/O readers aren't any MORE likely to believe it than the rest of the population. Plus, the whole, inaccurate popular notion of alpha/beta wolf dynamics has only a tangential bearing on what a/b/o fics are predominantly about: omegas, heats, self-lubing asses, knots, often mpreg and sexual d/s dynamics. Kink stuff.

SA

[(Anonymous)]

Well okay, I mostly agree with you. I will say, though, that I've read plenty of non-cracky omegaverse fic. So I wouldn't say it cant ever be taken seriously, any more than any other type of fanfic can't be taken seriously. But I agree that generally people who enjoy it are aware of the absurdity of the initial premise.

[tabaqui]

To me, it's kind of impossible to write RPS/RPF 'in character' - we *don't know them*! Their con personas or tv interview personas are *not them*.

I get that you don't care, and that's fine, you don't have to, but - it's never going to be in character, it's mostly just so whoever is reading can visual two hot guys with ease.

[(Anonymous)]

OMG I am not alone! I get soooo irritated about the whole A/B/O bullshit I can't get over it to enjoy any of the fics (not just RPF). I work in the dog training world and the amount of people who ACTUALLY believe the dynamics work in the A/B/O structure is baffling (they don't include the sex/kink things but just the idea of Alpha and dominance and all that). I wish I could put it aside to enjoy the sexy fic ... but I get annoyed and nope the fuck out.

But also, I agree with poster above ... RPF will never be "in character" so it's something that i'm not super into anyway.

[(Anonymous)]

I feel you: I have a friend who is so sold on the whole A/B/O shite: he constantly compares himself, and people he momentarily want to please, to Alphas, while he actually is a grumpy, small-minded, chronically ill sucker, with no education and who has never managed to keep a steady job in his life of soon 50 years. I don't have the heart to rip the poor bugger out of his illusions, but it is so ANNOYING!

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, there's really nothing that sparks my interest about RPF. The kind of stories about real people that interest me are not the kind of stories people write fic about (although I love those same stories when they are about fictional people).

[(Anonymous)]

Omegaverse doesn't have to do with wolf dynamics anymore, it's just many tropes that people mix in whatever way they like (sometimes even omitting common omegaverse tropes or adding new stuff).

It's not worse imo than any [insert trope] AU.

[(Anonymous)]

This, but also I sort of doubt many people were ever truly trying to base it off real wolf dynamics. It's become kind of a commonly known common misconception that wolf packs have an alpha and an omega, but the dynamic remains popular in fiction because it's simple and everyone reading it will understand what you were going for. In the case of omegaverse, it was an easy excuse for stories combining sex pollen + mpreg tropes.

[(Anonymous)]

Just chiming in to second what both of you are saying. :)

Links to actual Wolf Dynamics! Please!

[(Anonymous)]

I always wanted to study wolf pack dynamics/do animal behavior/ preservation research etc, but alas it is not my field. Do you have any good links on it?

Re: Links to actual Wolf Dynamics! Please!

[(Anonymous)]

/not OP

While I do not have any specific links, in nature a wolf pack consists of a mother, father and their kids. Obviously, only mom and dad have sex. When kids grow up and decide to have sex, they leave the pack and become moms and dads of their own pack. And that's basically it.

The root of the misunderstanding of the alpha/beta male in wolf hierarchy is the incorrect assumption that the male wolves in the pack are unrelated, which isn't the case in their natural environment. Of course the parent-wolf isn't going to let their child fuck their mom/sister.

[mimi_sardinia]

I generally agree about RPF. The vast majority of it is "Person With The Same Name And General Appearance Of Celebrity Does Stuff With Other Person With The Same Name And General Appearance Of Celebrity".

But then it is basically the same stuff as a lot of Modern AU fic too, which tends to be "Person With The Same Name And General Appearance Of Canon Character Does Ordinary Job And Meets Other Person With The Same Name And General Appearance Of Canon Character", which on a whole is a type of fic that I feel strips not only all personality out of the characters but also strips all the interest that exists in the world of that piece of fiction.

LotR Modern AU? Boring because a lot of the interest in LotR is Middle Earth, it's history, politics, landscape, etc.

Dragon Age? The majority of it's interest is Thedas, it's politics, the darkspawn, the Fade, etc.

Now I will give ground that a few Modern AUs can retain some of the canon flavour - like a modern AU retelling of the story, or say translating the canon world into a MMORPG (I have read that, it was Dragon Age), but most? Don't.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm sorry your friend is being a jerk and not listening when you say that you're not interested. (And I get how something that would be just "meh, not interested" can become your least favorite thing EVER when somebody just WILL NOT SHUT UP ABOUT IT.)

Maybe next time you bring it up, tell them that while you understand that it's something she really enjoys and wants to share with you, her talking about it all the time is actually making you even less interested?

[(Anonymous)]

I feel you, OP. I've once said I'd be interested in a/b/o if it weren't for mpreg, and I've had at least 2-3 people tell me that mpreg is a must-have, because otherwise IT WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN SCIENTIFICALLY CORRECT. Seriously.

I also laugh at the fact that fandom simultanously abhors seme/uke and has long rants about how wrong and offensive it is, and yet it's somehow ok when it's in the context of a/b/o, which is an EXTREME version of seme/uke.

[(Anonymous)]

"I also laugh at the fact that fandom simultanously abhors seme/uke and has long rants about how wrong and offensive it is, and yet it's somehow ok when it's in the context of a/b/o, which is an EXTREME version of seme/uke."

Huh, you know, I wonder if the two are actually directly related.
Seme/Uke is a huge kink ---> Seme/Uke is mocked and called problematic ---> Seme/Uke is renamed Alpha/Omega

And there's the plausible deniability that since it's more extreme, of course it's fantasy. Kinks (including non-sexual ones) don't just go away in fandom just like shipping wank doesn't go away, it just changes. I'm pretty sure if tomorrow somehow a fandom hatred of hurt/comfort started getting serious traction, within a couple years it would morph into 'Caretaker/Whumpee' and be about some people have a fantasy biological need to care for their mates and others have a biological need to be taken care of. ...... and I'd probably be right there reading and writing it while being salty as fuck that in my day h/c wasn't 'problematic and ablest trivializing of real life issues.'

[(Anonymous)]

Huh, you know, I wonder if the two are actually directly related.
Seme/Uke is a huge kink ---> Seme/Uke is mocked and called problematic ---> Seme/Uke is renamed Alpha/Omega

As the people in this thread who like a/b/o and actually read it on the regular keep reiterating: a/b/o is first and foremost about heat kink. It's also about mpreg, knots, and self-lubing arses. So most of the things people like about it aren't things that Seme/Uke has.

Now admittedly, a/b/o does often (though not always) involve sexual D/s dynamics. And sometimes those D/s dynamics do, to an extent, support a comparison to Seme/Uke dynamics. But honestly? Like half of the people I know who love a/b/o have never even read any Seme/Uke fic because they're not in any fandoms where that term is used. And the ones that have aren't embarrassed or secretive about it. So the idea that a/b/o is embraced by Seme/Uke fans as the ~unproblematic~ alternative to Seme/Uke is...just not very accurate at all.

And there's the plausible deniability that since it's more extreme, of course it's fantasy.

Also, the idea that a/b/o is an extreme version of Seme/Uke is not very correct. I've certainly read a/b/o fics that were quite extreme. But I've also read a/b/o fics where the Omega was more dominant. I've also read a/b/o fics where two Omega's were the main pairing. And I've read quite a few a/b/o fics where the Alpha and Omega were equally assertive and in control. It's not really possible to accurately generalize about a/b/o fics the way you've done here, because there's such a wide range of them and they're all different.

[(Anonymous)]

On the wolf thing, I'd bet money on most a/b/o fans being slightly more aware than alpha theory is utter nonsense than the general population.

Fans generally loathe MRA/PUA/Redpillers and everyone knows guys like that are all 'alpha theory is ttly real u guis' and it's stupid and wrong.

Fans are huge nerds and nerds love random facts. Probably especially random wolf facts because wolves are cool.

I've seen the occasional post about how alpha theory is stupid and was made up by nazi scientists go around on social media. Also random posts about wolves which include the tidbit that alpha theory is stupid and may also include it was invented by nazis.

So if it bugs you it's fine (for me, it's any joke that replies on 'hurr durr I heard tomatoes are a fruit and not a vegetable' No, eff you and your slightly wrong trivia) but I think odds are good fans and especially fans writing a/b/o have probably come across the fact that alpha theory is stupid and wrong, where as most non-fans are less likely to get exposed to that.