[ SECRET POST #4156 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #4156 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 31 secrets from Secret Submission Post #595.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

She still spends most of the movie dead to give him angst, though

[(Anonymous)]

Oh ffs. He genuinely loved her, and she wasn't simply a cardboard motivation. Why wouldn't there be angst?

Honestly, this was one of the few times that killing the hero's love didn't set my teeth of edge, mostly because a) the title sequence lampshading
b) the vengeance thing over him killing her killers was over in 5 minutes; most of his motivation was to protect the kid.
c) he brought her back at the end.

[(Anonymous)]

That's what fringing is, killing off a female character to give a male character angst.

[(Anonymous)]

DA - yes, sure, it's fridging by definition, but it was handled in a completely different way than for instance Janet Van Dyne in Antman, and ignoring the greater context doesn't make for great criticism.

[(Anonymous)]

How was what happened with Janet worse than Vanessa's treatment?

[(Anonymous)]

Inventing a cardboard love interest just for fridging angst sucks. Taking a cool female character with actual development, and saying 'nothing this character is capable of doing with her life is as valuable to the story as the male character angst we can wring out of killing her' also fucking sucks. Both are forms of fridging. One of them might bother you personally more, but there's no "oh well technically by definition, but -"

It's still fridging, and for some people the latter kind actually feels worst. Maybe someday we'll have more gender parity of protags and sacrifices and it'll just be a kind of tragedy that can happen, but today it's still a really shitty pattern for the Hero's girlfriend.

(All that said, I'm glad it's apparently Not Permanent, because that's usually boy territory, and I still want to see this movie. But I really object to the idea that because "he really loved her" or because she had a good character, that it was somehow less fridging. It totally still is.)

[(Anonymous)]

SA - I didn't say it wasn't fridging or that you shouldn't think it sucks. I'm just pointing out that there's more going on in this case than a traditional grudging, like the opening credits immediately agreeing with the audience about "what the fuck was that??!"

[(Anonymous)]

I think we're talking past each other. I feel like something can have other complicating factors and good points and still be very much "technically" and "traditionally" fridging. And I don't think the particular factors you listed originally are as different as you seemed to think they were.

And I'm honestly really tired of the wink-wink nudge-nudge 'we're going to use a harmful trope but mention that we know it sucks, that makes it fine to still basically use it whole cloth, right?' that a lot of pop culture tries to get away with these days. I felt the same way about all of Ant-man's "lmao isn't it funny and bad this movie isn't about Wasp" lampshading. It's not that edgy, it's not that funny, it just means the writers kinda knew this was a lazy trope that hurt people but couldn't bother to think of anything better. In Antman's case, I could maybe accept that studio mandates forced the writers' hands, but I think deadpool had a lot more room to go out of the box.

Honestly the whole thing would bother me so much less if people stopped trying to defend it. It can be a good movie and still contain a lousy trope in a lousy form. It doesn't have to """not count""" somehow for deadpool to still be fun and worth seeing for lots of people.

[rivulet027]

This. I'm still upset about Jan.

[(Anonymous)]

I'll argue your point b) here, his motivation for saving Russell was so that his "heart would be in the right place" and when he finally figured out how to kill himself, he could reunite with Vanessa. While he did ultimately save Russell, it wasn't for unselfish reasons.