fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4269 ]

[ SECRET POST #4269 ]

⌈ Secret Post #4269 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

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where 99.9% straight character 1 going for same gender character 2 doesn't make them Suddenly Gay Now and they have to actually deal with the social consequences of

A) still being 99.9% straight and seeing nothing in any other same-gender people,
B) still having a straight identity,
C) being in an openly and obviously gay relationship which they aren't ashamed of,
D) everyone else trying to claim them as gay or bi when they don't id that way, not due to homophobia but literally not being attracted to any other same-gender people

"i like one same gender person who Turned Me Gay and now i'm part of the queer community now and feel no more attraction toward opposite gender yay no problems" is a really annoying trope

/pet peeves

I....what....they would be bi wouldn't they?

identity is a more complex thing than that to me, hence pet peeve

brilliant example of D) though lol

It just seems like, while it's true that the way that we talk about queer identity and existing as part of a queer community are often more simplistic than the reality, this particular version of that is an extreme edge case. Which isn't bad in and of itself! It's just a little surprising, especially when it aligns with a trope (Only Gay For You) that's got a checkered history of usage in fiction.

yeah that's why i specifically mentioned that it's not due to a homophobia thing - which is the issue with the Special Exception trope - and the character is fine being perceived as queer socially and open about being in a queer relationship, but feeling it's wrong to label them as sexually bi or gay since they only experience attraction to opposite gender aside from one person

Sure, but how can you be socially straight when your relationship makes you be percieved as gay?

that's why i said "and the character is fine being perceived as queer socially and open about being in a queer relationship, but feeling it's wrong to label them as sexually bi or gay since they only experience attraction to opposite gender aside from one person"

But does a straight identity even matter at that point?

Re: What kind of romances do you want to see more of?

(Anonymous) - 2018-09-11 23:52 (UTC) - Expand

Well, if you 99.999% of the time prefer the opposite gender but find that rare one occasion... I dunno if you're bi. Bi seems to imply at least some regular active level of attraction for both sexes. If you find one exception to your sexuality and you don't normally like that gender, I think you're still straight. (or gay, as the cards may fall.)

Also, an identity is an identity, not a mathematically constructed formula

Well, sort of. An identity is an identity, but you're objectively not straight if you regularly are attracted to and fuck same-sex partners.

There's surely a point on the edges though where "bi" doesn't quite feel right because you're so massively pivoted one way. "Straight with the very occasional exception" would sound better.

Uhhhhhmmmmm

/shrug

i'm ok with a lesbian who has had feelings for one man in their lifetime still identifying as a lesbian, i don't see why a straight girl who likes one girl couldn't continue to ID as straight sexually + queer socially

it's something i don't see in romance plots, having to deal with those issues which are real things

I don't think it's a problem, and if it's a plot line that particularly works for you, great. It just doesn't seem to me like it's underrepresented I guess.

i feel it is, or rather that non-homophobic versions that deal with identity issues is. the ones that exist tend to deal with homophobia issues instead, and people "accepting they're queer" instead of "having to patiently explain to people that they wouldn't have a problem with this but they mostly really aren't so it's not accurate to say so"

none of this applies to myself or anything, i only want to see it because most stories - at least the ones I've seen - completely ignore this part and just have the person having been bi all along and growing to accept it

I don't think it's underrepresented in fandom (well, at least in characters who definitely like women being slashed with a guy, but usually fic veers them into Actively Bisexual territory) and it's also not underrepresented in Japanese BL/yaoi comics. (though sexuality isn't seriously explored in those usually).

But I think in mainstream stuff or serious stories (beyond a 28-page yaoi comic), straight guy falling in love with another guy while still identifying as straight is definitely underrepresented.

I think I've seen it more often with canon f/f pairings, though.

I agree with you, anon. I don't think finding that "one exception" makes you gay. And straight guy falling in love with another guy while still being straight otherwise is kind of a romantic kink for me.

if you want a concrete example of what a plot like this could be, a couple in a straight relationship where one half turns out to be trans, or a relationship where somehow due to plot convolutions one side assumes the other is the opposite gender while falling in love with them

partner is accepting of this, and now you have a 100% straight person who is still in love with someone who turned out to be the same gender as they are, and they have to deal with the social issues

"should they identify as bi now?" would be not as simplistic a question as most stories make it

I guess that would qualify. I remember that issue sort of being explored in Orange is the New Black.

I wouldn't say that's the romantic kink I was talking about, but surely interesting nonetheless.

oh yeah i was just adding more examples that could happen :)

Hmm idk. I’ve seen scenarios like this play out in the real world (usually with straight women dating queer women) and it... rarely works out. And usually ends up fucking with the one or both of the parties heads. Which I suppose could be part of the appeal.

well if it's fiction it could work out, right? it's daydream land after all :D

it'd just be nice to see it brought up in a romance. exploring the identity issues are what would be the appeal to me, and for once ending up at "no, I still feel 'straight' is the most accurate term for my actual sexuality but I'm fine with being a straight person in a gay relationship, now how do we explain that to people" instead of "I guess I was bi all along, I'm bi now!" would be... well, novel

I personally would want to also see the queer partners perspective because dating someone who is orientation incompatible with you is hard. Hard socially, hard personally, it can make it hard to connect to your partner if a queer identity is a big part of your life, it can make it hard to believe your partner is actually attracted to you - lots of stuff, some justified and some not.

I could be sold on it but it would have to be handled with razors edge delicacy imo.

oh, same. it would veer WAY too easily into "I'm straight because I can't accept I'm actually gay" homophobic territory

one concept I find fascinating is what if for example, an actress has a lesbian relationship. that actress and the other woman get turned into LGBT icons, but one half feels like a fraud because they are totally straight other than this one relationship, aren't part of the community, and don't even identify as gay. it's something that could easily break a relationship apart if like you said, one side has strong identity leanings with the group the other party feels like they're an impostor in

all sorts of fun stuff, lol

nayrt but as a lesbian myself - I agree with your last point, I think the only scary thing about dating a straight person would be questioning whether they are really attracted to you. I feel like with guys, arousal is more external (for obvious reasons) so it might be a little different. But for me, I'd question if a female partner really was into me, or was just doing it for the experience or to brag about it for weird feminist cred. Plus the fear that goes with it of "will they want to stay with me long term or is this just a phase/do they ultimately want to end up with the opposite sex."

"Queer identity" means nothing to me though. I personally have zero interest in Pride stuff or the "community" of LGBT beyond what it means for social progress. I don't feel any more connected on a human level with people who have similar sexual interests as me. It's not my identity at all. Beyond sexual attraction and romantic commitment, queerness is a moot point for me.

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