fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #589 ]

⌈ Secret Post #589 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

101.

__________________________________________________

102.

__________________________________________________

103.

__________________________________________________

104.

__________________________________________________

105.

__________________________________________________

106. [repeat]

__________________________________________________

107.

__________________________________________________

108.

__________________________________________________

109.

__________________________________________________

110. [repeat]

__________________________________________________

111.

__________________________________________________

112. [not fandom]

__________________________________________________

113.

__________________________________________________

114.

__________________________________________________

115.

__________________________________________________

116.

__________________________________________________

117.

__________________________________________________

118.

__________________________________________________

119.

__________________________________________________

120.

__________________________________________________

121.

__________________________________________________

122.

__________________________________________________

123.

__________________________________________________

124.

__________________________________________________

125.

__________________________________________________

126.

__________________________________________________

127.

__________________________________________________

128.

__________________________________________________

129.

__________________________________________________

130.

__________________________________________________

131.

__________________________________________________

132.

__________________________________________________

133.

__________________________________________________

134.

__________________________________________________

135.

__________________________________________________

136.

__________________________________________________

137.

__________________________________________________

138.

__________________________________________________

139.

__________________________________________________

140.

__________________________________________________

141.

__________________________________________________

142.

__________________________________________________

143.

__________________________________________________

144.

__________________________________________________

145.

__________________________________________________

146.

__________________________________________________

147.

__________________________________________________

148.

__________________________________________________

149.

__________________________________________________

150.

__________________________________________________

151.

__________________________________________________

152.

__________________________________________________

153.

__________________________________________________

154.

__________________________________________________

155.

__________________________________________________

156.

__________________________________________________

157.

__________________________________________________

158.

__________________________________________________

159.

__________________________________________________

160.

__________________________________________________

161.

__________________________________________________

162.

__________________________________________________

163.

__________________________________________________

164.

__________________________________________________

165.

__________________________________________________

166.

__________________________________________________

167.

__________________________________________________

168.

__________________________________________________

169.

__________________________________________________

170.

__________________________________________________

171.

__________________________________________________

172.

__________________________________________________

173.

__________________________________________________

174.

__________________________________________________

175.

__________________________________________________

176.

__________________________________________________

177.

__________________________________________________

178.

__________________________________________________

179.

__________________________________________________

180.

__________________________________________________

181.

__________________________________________________

182.

__________________________________________________

183.

__________________________________________________

184.

__________________________________________________

185.

__________________________________________________

186.

__________________________________________________

187.

__________________________________________________

188.

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 25 pages, 619 secrets from Secret Submission Post #085.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 - not!secrets ], [ 1 2 3 4 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 4 5 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 - repeat ], [ 1 - posted twice ], [ 1 - take it to comments ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I do agree with you that Girl-Wonder.org has issues (and, as an outsider, the lack of an updated and comprehensive view is especially easy to spot as an issue), but Girl-Wonder is only one website and the points that they make about the sexualization of violence are more or less valid if not out of date.

I don't think that what you've been saying about every fandom feminist existing to perpetuate victimhood is fair. Do you not believe there are any issues with the treatment of female characters in media, or do you just believe that every fandom feminist is going to be as fiercely defensive as Stephanie Brown's fans?

Considering that "fandom feminist" is the term I use for people who act like that (because there just *isn't* a good term to use for it, you should *see* the fallout from some of my other posts about what I used to call them) yes, I do believe that "fandom feminists" are going to be as fiercely defensive and whiny as Steph Brown's fans.

Real feminists, on the other hand, are the ones who promote equality with a reasonable argument and understanding. They don't bitch about how high-heeled boots are the bane of feminine empowerment or cry 'victim' and 'misogynyst' every time a heroine gets into (and out of) some sort of trouble. They make clear, concise arguments about the things that are really important and know when a story element is just a god-damn story element.

Real feminists, on the other hand, are the ones who promote equality with a reasonable argument and understanding. They don't bitch about how high-heeled boots are the bane of feminine empowerment or cry 'victim' and 'misogynyst' every time a heroine gets into (and out of) some sort of trouble. They make clear, concise arguments about the things that are really important and know when a story element is just a god-damn story element.

And those feminists, when they apply themselves to fandom, tend to refer to themselves as "fandom feminists."

I don't know what else you tried to call them, but you're still inadvertantly painting everyone with the same brush. The way I see it, you shouldn't be complaining about feminists at all - just the arguments that you find superflous, ridiculous or demeaning.

What I'm complaining about are the people who call themselves 'feminists' and then use those superflous, ridiculous and demeaning arguments. It's nearly to address the arguments without adressing the people who are making them, especially when it seems to be an entire mindset.

I've tried every term I can think of. Can't called the "Womyn" without offending the part of the non-nutso feminists who take that term seriously. Can't call them "fandom feminists" or "comic book feminists" without including "Feminazis" was just a disaster, and I somehow doubt that "feminuts" is going to be any better. There's just *nothing* to call them that doesn't include somebody who doesn't belong under the term.

Then don't call them anything. Address the arguments you have issue with instead of trying to categorize the people who are making those arguments.

Thank you for pointing out the problems here! ITA with all you've said.

Just wanted to say that this comment rocks.

Thank you.

I totally agree. Categorizing people who are making bad or ridiculous arguments under some kind of umbrella merely allows you to dismiss them with a wave of your hand instead of actually pointing out where their arguments fail. The more that you do that without resorting to "naming" them, the more that the kind of argument you prefer will be circulated. If you keep your argument on that level you'll find you'll be listened to more often.

In addition, if you don't understand that in a society with a marked power differential biases "for" and biases "against" are not the same thing and cannot be treated the same (not unlike that old bugbear 'reverse racism' which hello, does not exist) then you need to rethink the arguments. Given that men and women don't start on an even playing field, the biases cannot be treated in the same way.

[ SECRET POST #589 ]

Re: 174

Re: 174

Re: 174

Re: 174

Re: 174

Re: 174

Re: 174

Re: 174

Re: 174