fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #593 ]

[ SECRET POST #593 ]

⌈ Secret Post #593 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 09 pages, 215 secrets from Secret Submission Post #085.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 4 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 3 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Um, sorry. I have to disagree. When it comes to the amount of evil committed, in terms of body-count, Islam > Christianity. I don't like either, mind you, but at least Christianity is peaceful in theory. Islam...not so much.

but at least Christianity is peaceful in theory. Islam...not so much

You should at least research what you're talking about before making foolish statements.

I agree. Ignorant people never fail to baffle me.

You assume that I came to this conclusion due to lack of research. On the contrary, I used to believe otherwise until I actually read the Koran, and more specifically, the Hadith.

The Crusades, the forcible conversion and murder of Jews in the 15th century, witch burnings and hangings, the millions of deaths in the Reformation and Inquisition because Christians used to love killing each other over fine print and bullet points? Totally > radical Islamic terrorism today.

And just try to tell me that some of the whacko Dominionists aren't as nuts as the Taleban.

Hmm, I suppose that Christianity can give Islam a run for its money.

Still, the Armenian Genocide: 300 000 -> 1 500 000, depending on the country.
Darfur Genocide: 400 000, probably more, although that's still happening.
Iraqi Shia/Tsuni conflict: 70 000, give or take about 15 000. Also, still going on.

And that's just in the last century.

Okay, millions of deaths in the Spanish Inquisition? Wow, that's wrong. If you make it out to be millions of deaths in the three Inquisitions combined, you're still wrong. That would be as much as, if not more than, the number of people killed by the Black Death. Which, as we know, killed up to two thirds of the population of Europe at the time.

Now, the Black Death is certainly a topic worth talking about if we want to talk about Christian evils. Such as ignorant townspeople massacring Jews because they believed that the Jews caused the plague (and why not? The Jews used different water supplies and maintained more hygeinic practises, thus they did not get sick as often as the Christians). That, and it was also a way of revolting against a monarchy that protected the Jews to the extent of disfavouring their own, Christian subjects. There was no go ahead from the Church, the Church was too busy struggling to stay on it's feet. Most of the clergy were dying because they were taking care of the sick, and the people replacing them weren't as well trained in matters of the Church, just in matters of alleviating suffering.

In fact, a lot of the evils you speak of are what happens when you have a large group of ignorant people and some sort of calamity that the people in charge can't control. Plague, and the Church can't stop it? Destroy people who are different, because clearly it's their fault. Crops won't grow or children are dying of illnesses? Must be a witch.

All else fails, just be a radically different minority that has a lot of power, or a radically different minority who feels that the majority is all a bunch of Devil worshippers.

It's not the religion, it's the people.

Oh, and the Crusades weren't really about religion at all. Just wealthy noblemen and royalty seeking to fatten their coffers.

Yeah, you just summed up my beef. I was too lazy to write that all out.

Islam, on the other hand, is all about conquest this, and jihad that, and stone this (usually a woman), and subjugate that (usually infidels). Basically what I'm getting at is: When people actually follow Christian precepts to the letter, divinely inspired or not (I lean towards the 'not'), they generally aren't all that violent. When a Muslim actually follows Islamic precepts to the letter...well, you get Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Iran, and Afghanistan.

The fundamental difference between Crusaders and Suicide bombers is that the foot soldiers of the former were generally illiterate, and couldn't read their own Bible. But in the case of the latter, they have usually memorized entire passages from the Koran.

You're totally right that the numbers are wrong; what was I thinking? My bad. I suck at maths.

But I dispute that it was all about money. There were clearly people who believed in what they were doing.

LOL. Ever heard of the Armenian Genocide?

How about Darfur?

at least Christianity is peaceful in theory. Islam...not so much.

I facepalmed so hard, my face caved in.

Here, some 'theory' for you.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/cruelty/long.html

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/donald_morgan/atrocity.html

Well, I stand corrected on Christianity. I've read more of the Koran than I have of the New Testament, after all.

Organized religion, this is why I hate you so much. Islam, Christianity, Hinduism (lol, you were born a member of the warrior caste, so it's okay for you to kill people!).

Waitaminute. Fail source is fail. I do not stand corrected, because apparently I understand Christian Dogma better than this site. New Testament pretty much overrides the Old, and the New Testament has, like, one passage about 'the sword'. Everything else, from what I've seen, is sunshine and daisies.

New Testament pretty much overrides the Old

Nope, sorry, you fail again. When Christians get pissy about homoseuxality, they quote Leviticus.

Nope. They use Leviticus as a buffer. The real reason behind their anti-homosexuality is PAUL. Paul is also the reason why women are not supposed to become clergy. Kindly stop failing.

Because if they gave two shits about the Old Testament, they would keep the dietary laws and not work on the Sabbath (the latter is punishable by death, BTW).

Re: 187

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-21 02:50 (UTC) - Expand

Re: 187

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-21 03:31 (UTC) - Expand

That being said, I think that Christianity is an illogical belief system that promotes not taking responsibility for one's actions. And I can certainly see why murder is easier to reconcile with the whole Jesus-cleansing-all-sins thing.

But it's only one factor of many in the fail of the last 2000 years, and I do believe that, at its core, it is nonviolent.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/mt/cr_list.html
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/mk/cr_list.html
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/lk/cr_list.html
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/jn/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/acts/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/rom/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/1cor/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/eph/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/1th/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/2th/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/heb/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/jas/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/1pet/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/2pet/cr_list.html

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/jude/cr_list.html

And my favorite part of the Bible of all:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/rev/cr_list.html

~~Jossed~~

Fuck me.

Re: New Testament

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-21 02:46 (UTC) - Expand

Re: New Testament

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-21 02:47 (UTC) - Expand

Re: New Testament

pentha.livejournal.com - 2008-08-21 03:16 (UTC) - Expand

Re: New Testament

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-21 03:38 (UTC) - Expand

Re: New Testament

(Anonymous) - 2008-08-21 04:54 (UTC) - Expand

These sites fail to differentiate between Old and New Covenants, and provide no context.

Eeek, shoddy, very shoddy.

You don't really know anything at all about Christianity, do you?

They provide the verses as well as links to the context for you to check them out yourself. The Bible is the Old and New Testament because, basically, all major Christian dogmas believe that the God of Abraham and Isaak is also the God of the Gospels, and the Messiah of the prophets from the Old Testament is Jesus Christ.

Next.

Wow, Not Getting It.

Not Even Spelling Things Properly. D:

The old covenant refers to Old Testament Mosaic law, which required rituals and sacrifices. Kosher kitchen rules are a modern descendant of these.

The new covenant is spoken about first in the book of Jeremiah. It's also all over the New Testament (e.g. Moses 5:17).

The new covenant supercedes the law of Moses.

(deleted comment)

Agreed, in any case it only takes a few bad apples to ruin the image of the whole bunch. Media will play upon the fears of people, and people in general fear those who are different from themselves.

Gah, I deleted my comment because I thought it wasn't worth posting to begin with, but.

I'm kind of amazed by how many people are bringing up Islam elsewhere in this post. It's not the religion that makes people evil. People are evil whenever there's a like-minded group that is given power. Religion is obviously just the biggest example of this, but come on. People would still be evil if religion didn't exist, because they would still form groups, and those groups would still try to subjugate and hurt others.

Concepts aren't evil. People with power are.

I'm not blaming Islam for some Muslims being evil, but I stand by my assertion that it's a religion that emphasizes violence, misogy, xenophobia, and expansionism. By all means, read through the Koran and the Hadith, instead of the few quotes used for misleading apologetics.

Islam isn't alone, of course. Hinduism has its share of violent and disturbing literature, as does, of course, the Judeo-Christian tradition. Blaming everything on religion is stupid, as well, but to exclude its influence entirely is equally retarted. There's a reason why there are no Jewish, Hindu, and Christian suicide bombers: Those religions do not promise heaven after martyrdom.

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