fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #606 ]

[ SECRET POST #606 ]

⌈ Secret Post #606 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 13 pages, 402 secrets from Secret Submission Post #087.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 3 4 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 - repeat ], [ 1 2 3 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

105: Ahaha, nothing will ever convince me that the way in which Milo and Adrian act towards each other in Heroes is 'brotherly'. I'm sorry. If that's pathetic or unrealistic to you, then fine, but I have never seen two brothers look at each other like that and doubt I ever will. And really, do Italian people stare at their brothers or sisters lips? Cause that? Doesn't seem quite normal to me.

108: LMAO. This is one of the few things I don't wish I could unsee. XD (I've never been a big fan of Papa John's but suddenly I have a whole new appreciation for them.)

112. Oh GOD, I feel you. (Not about my real friends, but the rest of it, yea.) I wish I didn't, but Rodney is my homeboy and imagining my Friday's without him is painful in ways it shouldn't be. I love and can relate to his character in so many ways, and man, have I grown attached to him. He's become my favorite fictional character too. I feel like I know him personally. Maybe it's silly, but I feel like it's going to be impossible to get over him. And now you've got me crying again. Thanks. XD

128: ... I have a hard time believing this is real. I HOPE it isn't. However if it is, my perversions have nothing on yours.

137: So you couldn't, just, you know, ignore the fandom or even the PARTS of fandom that squick you? Your loss.

151: Wow, The Joker actually looks pretty damn fine in this picture. Still wouldn't screw him though. (And yay for believing in Harvey Dent! Or wanting Harvey Dent to be in you. Both, I guess.)

182: XD Aww, I wish Sam and Peter were buddies. ~~(Where they could go on and on about their epic love for their brothers.)~~ I definitly have my moments too where I'll forget if something happened in canon or if I just read it in fanfic. Also FTW about Donna's breasts.

*shakes fist at weather for making my internet it's bitch* I can only see half the secrets. D: *sighs and reloads*

They've been my fave pizza place since I was a little kid... and I just recently got into SPN and I adore Papa >D So you can imagine the giggle-squees when I first made the connection in my brainballs. I just burst into random giggles for the rest of the night. My family thought I'd just gone insane >D

To a much dorkier extent I also burst into gigglies and "Deans" brand milk and "Sam's choice" Oh lord... Look what SPN has DONE to me? XD In one fatal swoop it's turned me into the creepy woman in Wal-mart laughing to herself at random moments =.='

AHAHA. You’re totally adorable. I only WISH I could make those kinds of connections, but it’s rare that I do. God, I’ve been using “Sam’s Choice” for years and been going to “Sam’s Club” and it’s never occurred to me! Granted, I too just got into SPN (this year for me), but still, I’m surprised I didn’t see it. And I don’t recall “Deans” brand milk, but that’s precious.

If it makes you feel any better I DID come across a dental office called “Sylar’s dental” and cracked the hell up. (In case you don’t know, Sylar is a character from Heroes.) So, yea. XD

And I’d totally talk to the creepy woman in Wal-Mart laughing at herself at random moments. Or just laugh with her.

Milo and Adrian I don't know. And to be honest I don't knwo about the lip.
but I'm usually rub my face against my brother. And the same is for my boyfriend with his brother. I don't know... I don't find it really strange like other people..

Different people find different things to be out of the ordinary. If you don’t find it strange, more power to you. I would most likely find it a bit odd, but I didn’t grow up with siblings that choose to be affectionate in that way nor did I grow up seeing siblings act like that. I’m not judging anyone, mind you, I just think The Petrelli brothers are a strange example of a sibling relationship as, like I said, all the sibling relationships I’ve seen have been drastically unlike there’s. (And yes, different places have different practices and all that; I know. I mean, we haven’t even seen a picture of Nathan and his WIFE on their WEDDING day. Just Peter and Nathan over and over again. That’s not normal.) Uncommon doesn’t mean nonexistent though, so maybe there –are- real life equivalents to The Petrelli brothers out there. I’m just not entirely convinced that the way in which Milo and Adrian play them can entirely be written off with “they’re Italian”. … Especially because of the lip thing.

You need to differentiate between Milo/Adrian and Peter/Nathan. I very much doubt the script ever says stuff like

PETER stares at NATHAN'S lips wistfully.
(You know what I mean.) And if you'd like to examine what kind of relationship exactly exists between the actors, that's a whole other story, but you'll certainly be able to find likeminded parts of fandom who'll discuss it with you.

Side observation: online fandom is so focused on romance and sexual behaviors, we'll sacrifice a considerable portion of the original material's meaning and intent in order to create more plausibility for our preferred scenarios.

In the particular case of onscreen siblings, you've pretty much got three options, all three of which go against mainstream common practices: incest, real-person fic (a lot of which includes adultery and/or established, assumed bisexuality), or alternate universes. I think one reason why incest is so popular in fandom avenues is because a lot of the audience for it starts out shipping it in jest. As the output of fan-generated media centered on it increases, so do people's involvement and interest. Then there's the probable effects of groupthink, but that's another tl;dr I won't bore you with today. ;)

The other main contributor, I think, is a "path of least resistance" type of reasoning, where real person fic is still very much a taboo, and alternate universes require too much mental restructuring of canon (iow, you don't want to think too hard). Fandom gets away with incest because none of it is real, anyway.

But out of curiousity; since you have personally never seen two siblings behave towards each other in the way that Nathan and Peter do, if you ever do eventually see it, would you automatically assume they're engaged in incestuous relations? Further, if they tell you that they are not, would you be able to accept that, or would you doubt their word?

I'm honestly asking, 'cause this entire perception and interpretation issue is rather fascinating to me.

First of all, you probably shouldn’t take anything I said too seriously, since this –is- fandom, and I –was- speaking in jest, but since you seem to actually want to know, ok.

Also, I do differentiate between Milo/Adrian and Peter/Nathan, and I don’t think there’s anything going on between either Milo/Adrian or Peter/Nathan. However, I DO think the subtext is there for anyone who wishes to see it, and TPTB (the actors, the writers, whoever) do a poor job of hiding it or discouraging it from fangirls who they –know- will analyze everything to hell. (Ask yourself, do they even really want to discourage it, seeing as it could bring them a whole new audience who are interested in seeing what all the fuss is about? Kring didn’t seem to be too upset about the thought that fangirls were seeing something ‘else’ between Nathan and Peter; the guy probably scoffed and went back to writing his much beloved brotherly scenes.)

Do some viewers interpret certain scenes and actions differently (even based on what they want to see?)? Of course. That’s the way things work. (Remember this is fandom honey, people don’t even have to be in the same series to be paired together.)

On the Milo/Adrian front, I’m simply saying that I feel they do no favors (or many favors, depending on who you ask) to discourage Peter/Nathan. Make no mistake, they have great chemistry, I just don’t think it’s the type of chemistry two people playing brothers should have. And don’t get me wrong, I think they’re both great actors, but I’ve never been able to convincingly see them as siblings. So, no, I can see the difference between Milo/Adrian and Peter/Nathan (and even see the difference between Peter and Nathan in other mediums than the TV show – the graphic novel, for instance – but this is about the TV show and their characters there), what I’m saying is I don’t think Peter and Nathan, as Milo and Adrian play them (which I guess is what you’re pointing out), seem quite normal on that front. In the end Milo and Adrian ARE Peter and Nathan though. Whatever Kring saw fit to be in the TV show is canon, so even if you argue Peter and Nathan aren’t looking at each others lips wistfully, they kind of are, because Milo and Adrian, their actors, saw fit to play the scene that way. (And hey, if Kring didn’t make them do another take, apparently he saw nothing wrong with it.) No, I don’t think ‘PETER stares at NATHAN’S lips wistfully’ was in the script, and I definitely don’t think that was Kring’s intention, but the brothers staring at each others lips still ended up in the finished product, so it’s still there for people to take notice of.

I hear ya. It's when people are utterly convinced Peter and Nathan are in a canon sexual relationship because, you know, "zomg see how they look at each other? PROOF!" that maybe I start looking at them like they're a little crazy. If they're aware, as you seem to be, that they are purposefully taking elements of canon in a way that can be extrapoled and interpreted to mean something other than the script implies, I have no qualms whatsoever about that.

And I'm inclined to agree about TPTB playing to it, definitely. They enjoy whatever attention they can get, and I think this one type in particular is one that amuses them very much, with which they liked to have fun and through which they may establish a sort of connivence with its audience, all in good fun.

Yea, I’m sure Kring didn’t start out going ‘let’s add subtext!’ but as he saw what kind of fandom the show garnered, I wouldn’t be surprised if he intentionally added certain things with the fangirls in mind. It’s what shows do; TPTB have admitted it in the past. (Not Kring or the Heroes PTB, that I know of anyway, but other PTB.)

And I would never be OMG CANON INCEST unless the incest was actually implied or explicitly shown. Shipping in fandom is fun for me, and sure there are moments where I take my ships pretty seriously, but I'm not -crazy- about it. I know what's real and what's not and don't mind admitting it.

As for online fandom being focused on romance and sexual relationships, I’m not going to argue with you there. (Not that I’m trying to argue with you in the rest of this; simply trying to state my opinion.) It is and will probably forever be. Although, I do think most people have a firm grasp of the original intent of the material even if they see other things; like me, they might think the relationship between the Petrelli brothers looks a bit fishy on screen, but they’re still well aware there’s nothing going on in canon and that Kring didn’t plan for any of this. We –can- see what’s in front of us. Most of us, anyway.

I can’t personally speak for fandom as to why incest is so popular, nor would I want to; although for some people I think it has more to do with the particular characters in question than the fact that those characters are actually siblings: in other words, if they weren’t siblings they would ship it, so they ship it regardless. Once again, I’m sure that’s not the case for everyone, but that’s how I feel about it to a certain extent, and I’ve crossed paths with a few people who seem to feel that way themselves. Do I think incest is serious? Certainly. Do I think incest in a highly unrealistic and fictional environment is serious? Not really. In the back of my mind I know it’s not real, and that changes things for me. (For instance, one of my favorite bands happens to have a large incestuous RPS following, and yet I don’t participate in it; why? Because it’s real. Like I said, that changes things for me. I’m not going to dump on people who do read it, but for me that does change things. Just goes to show you how different people will see different things and different people will respond or be put off by different things.)

I honestly doubt if I were to see two siblings react as Nathan and Peter do to each other that my first thought would be ‘incestuous relationship’! It gets mentioned often, but I still feel I need to point out that fandom and its fictional relationships are an entirely different beast. However, would I think it a bit strange to see two siblings interact like The Petrelli brothers do? Yes. Might it even jokingly pass my mind that they were in an incestuous relationship? Yes. Would it ever seriously cross my mind that they could truly be in a relationship of that nature? Most likely not, unless they were interacting in a way I thought to be –extremely- outrageous for siblings, which in real life would probably never happen. So, yes, fandom is different. And unless I saw two siblings making out I would probably just think their relationship to be a bit odd and wouldn’t question it, certainly if they were to say they weren’t in a relationship of that nature (even though, I wouldn't be asking them in the first place, because awwwkkkkward, and so not my business.)

Man, I hope you –really- got something out of this. (Half of it probably doesn’t even make sense, but hey, you asked, I answered, so be happy. XD)

Although, I do think most people have a firm grasp of the original intent of the material even if they see other things; like me, they might think the relationship between the Petrelli brothers looks a bit fishy on screen, but they’re still well aware there’s nothing going on in canon and that Kring didn’t plan for any of this. We –can- see what’s in front of us. Most of us, anyway.

I'm right there with you on that one. It's the few that don't see this that sort of make me headdesk a lot.

Do I think incest in a highly unrealistic and fictional environment is serious? Not really. In the back of my mind I know it’s not real, and that changes things for me.

Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. You obviously see the difference between fiction and real world relationships.

I (mis)took OP's concerns to be about the people that don't, and that find inappropriateness in families displaying affection toward each other so unabashedly. Those people exist, in and out of online fandom, and I just think it's rather sad. It's just a fact that online fandom banalizes that mode of thinking, nolens volens.

This has been enlightening, yes. Thanks for taking the time. :)

Eh, the thing about fandom is there will ALWAYS be people who make you want to headdesk. Just ignore them.

Haha, it's amazing that this had to be pointed out, but I suppose fandom IS pretty bizarre these days. Fiction is one thing, and real life is a whole 'nother rodeo. If the OP hugs or touches her brother often you won't see me freaking out about it. I don't do it and haven't seen it, so I might find it a bit odd, but it's not out of the realm of proper contact or anything. If she were making out with her brother then yea, that would be...rather uncomfortable and a TOTALLY different matter, but, still not my business. >.>

You're most welcome.

(I swear it doesn't take me THAT long to come up with a comment, my internet just hates me.)

http://fc04.deviantart.com/fs15/f/2007/092/a/b/Sam_vs__Peter_by_toeatsmoke.jpg

105: Where I'm from a lot of men, especially family, kiss on the lips. I've also seen some watch each other's lips while they're talking (I don't watch Heroes so I don't know if that's when it happens though) because it's just another way to show they are paying attention to what they are saying and is a way to switch up between staring them down in their eyes.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #606 ]

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