[ SECRET POST #5161 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #5161 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 39 secrets from Secret Submission Post #739.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, if you think hiphop culture should be exclusive to black Americans. Which In Principle I wouldn't have shit against, but at least be honest about it. Why the hell is Eminem OK but Korean kids doing the same shit isn't.

[meadowphoenix]

I'm genuinely not sure what part of my comment you're responding to but plenty of black americans did not think eminem was okay, and the consumers of his rap tended not to be black americans. also eminem actually grew up in the 'hood and didn't rap in a blaccent so it wasn't actually an imitation like across the pacific. perhaps get it together.

second, my point was that regardless of how you felt about the imitation, they were in fact imitating and it's downright silly to pretend they weren't.

third, generally the criticism was always going to spring up because nobody likes prospective rappers who aren't any good. thankfully the korean rappers in boybands have gotten some skill (BTS has some really good rappers), because in "hip hop culture" you will get clowned for anything and everything if you ain't any good. that's the first rule of hip hop. Nobody really cares about fakers if they're brilliant. maybe muscians should not try to take the good without the bad if they want to be a part of the culture

[(Anonymous)]

Maybe I'm missing 100% of this context because I'm not American and therefore, as a non-American, all I'm seeing is Eminem making lots of money and I can't really tell accents apart (and I doubt 14 year old kids who learned English by listening to songs can, either - and I'm not a BTS fan but I know that's how the lead vocal/rapper/boy RM got his start). So I'm sorry.

All I was trying to explain is that yes KHH is a thing and has been for at least 30 years now. And no, of course they didn't learn to rap or the meanings of American hiphop slangs in their neighborhood, they did by listening to radio and it was basically an internet fandom for them, devoid of any cultural context because of the way it came to them, they probably liked how it sounded and/or the aesthetic ressonated and that was it. I know (because I'm into k-pop but not particularly into BTS...) RM got his start in his teens by making mixtapes ... I don't see how it's cringey, it's literally some Korean kid trying to rap. Again, maybe I AM lacking some context. (Of course I'm not saying his rap isn't cringey, just that liking American hiphop culture as a foreigner shouldn't be IMO.)

Yeah, again, I don't know anything about American hiphop culture but I know they are hard on the clowning part in KHH shows. Which I don't like/watch anyway But.

[meadowphoenix]

The problem black people have with it is the appropriation not the cringe. That hiphop was presented as globally consumable does not make it better, or grant its korean creators less responsibility for appropriation, when it's similarly globally regurgitated.

but you've caught onto the cringey thing....when people say and do things that have knowable context but aren't using them in the correct context. that's cringey. it's much harder for people within dominant cultures to understand cultural context as specific and something researchable before imitation, but yes it's cringe when its clear people have no context for they're saying and doing.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, I totally agree with this. This is what I meant to say and hoped to agree on. It's not cringey because it's Korean kids enjoying American hiphop, right? (Hope not because I was once a foreign kid enjoying kpop lol.) It's cringey because their companies probably know better about not being offensive/appropriative. So some things should just stop yeah. But should "rap" in kpop stop, too? What I think makes it a less easy answer is the fact that KHH has been a thing for 30 years now. So would it be better for the companies to alienate Korean audiences who enjoyed KHH (and it was very out of any "real", roots' American hiphop context) from 1990-2020 because now Americans listen to k-pop and aren't happy about it? Or keep releasing different music for different audiences like it's the 1990s again and we have to censor stuff for audiences in different nations? Sorry I am terrible at explaining my point without being offensive but maybe I explained it now.

[meadowphoenix]

No there's nothing cringey about listening to hip hop or kpop. It's the packaging for consumption that becomes a problem. And for me, there's no problem with kpop rapping, though again quality matters to me. I'll be honest, I don't think it will alienate korean/japanese/chinese kpop listeners if they rap in their "singing" voices, nor if change up aesthetics. And they HAVE! the groups now have very few of the specific problems groups had before even in their home releases, now it's just shitty stuff they say about black people in their own time and for some reason record.

but yes, you can't propagate stereotypes that will attach to black people, because they will even if you think khh is its own thing, and not expect some issues. the symbols they are using aren't just things you can disassociate from the global context, and view of black people, culture, music. everywhere else also received those black stereotypes, they are still being propagated around the world even today, and so receivers of korean music are having those stereotypes reinforced even if you believe khh is its own thing. unfortunately symbols do that.