[ SECRET POST #5235 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #5235 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 11 secrets from Secret Submission Post #749.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

04. https://i.imgur.com/daNBs9b.png

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, honestly, that was a pretty big tip-off.

[(Anonymous)]

I think it's a little simplistic and maybe not great to collapse "not woke" into a singularity where making shitty, racist casting decisions is indistinguishable from being actively abusive to your employees

[(Anonymous)]

We all knew it in 2005, we just didn't give a fuck about wokeness.

[(Anonymous)]

And do you think that's a good or a bad thing?

[(Anonymous)]

lol who cares

[(Anonymous)]

I agree that not having a single Chinese MC was a really bad call. That said, I've always wondered whose call it was. Because it may well have been Joss' call, but it seems equally possible it was the network's call. Like, given Simon and River's last name it kind of feels like they were meant to be at least part Chinese—but then they went and cast white people in the roles. Also, the fact that they cast Summer Glau...kind of feels like they cast the most "Eastern-looking" white girl they could find? *winces*

And on the one hand, Joss is an asshole, and it's clear that he's shitty at behaving in accordance with the ideals he claims to hold, so I'm not super inclined to defend him or anything. But otoh, I could 100% see the network going, "You already have two black MCs and a Brazilian-American MC; you can't have two Asian MCs too, that's too many! Less than half of your MCs will be white!! You're going to alienate your white audience!!! You can have your black characters, because that's the kind of representation Americans actually give half a shit about, and you can have a drop-dead gorgeous and borderline white-passing sex worker character because that's ~exotic~ and actually we prefer when the heavily sexualized characters are POCs. But that's it, that's where we're putting our foot down!"

[(Anonymous)]

Ehhh... yeah, it could easily be a network decision (I mean, I've seen some networks try to insist that African God characters are given white castings, so that's totally believable) but it's probably worth noting that, given that people have presumably been in space for years, probably mixing racially in various ways for generations, it's not THAT out there for somebody of a non-specific white racial appearance to have a currently racially specific surname, especially if they pass in a similar way to now.

If their surname was intended to be East Asian it's not out there that they had one male Chinese ancestor 5 generations ago and various European or mixed people marrying in and retaining the surname since.

While he should have definitely had a Chinese actor in some role in the series, it's kind of easy to explain that shit away in future homogenised science-fiction land.

'cos let's face it, a White/Chinese couple will have a mixed looking child. If that mixed child has children with somebody white, and then that child does the same, the result is going to be pretty much European in appearance by that point. Hell, I know somebody with one Indian (from India) grandparent and they basically look white. Light brown hair, blue eyes, skin as pale as my own. English first name, Indian surname. They're used to the "Really?" by this point.

Joss Whedon is definitely a tool and he definitely doesn't have a varied enough cast considering the setting, but as a science fiction writer myself, I don't think it's too out there for a white looking person to have an East Asian surname.

It's pretty fuckin' out there to have a Chinese/English language space setting and have no overtly Chinese looking characters though, especially when there's that one obviously miscellaneous Slavic guy in one/more of the episodes.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, you can make that excuse for any one character - my kid is white/Asian and looked very much white until he was about 11, and people didn't believe that he and his sister were full siblings - but you're right that it's just one small symptom of a much much bigger problem.

[(Anonymous)]

I always assumed Summer Glau was at least part Asian. Was I wrong?

[(Anonymous)]

Scots Irish and German ancestry according to Wikipedia.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think Morena Baccarin is a POC, actually. Wikipedia lists her as a Brazilian of Italian descent.

[(Anonymous)]

I had major issues with Firefly from the beginning (though I recall liking the film oddly enough) and was sick of my friends (and everyone online, it seemed) talking about how it is 'the best thing evah! Only one season waaah'. At that point, I also felt that the appropriation of Chinese culture was weird without any actual Chinese people on the show. I also had issues with the portrayal of Inara.
Though I did like Joss Whedon, at one point, any discussion of the problematic aspects in his work was seen as sacriligious. It was always 'oh those feminists making waves again'. It's sad that it took the fact that the guy himself is a bit of a prick, to take a more critical look at his work.
To quote Picard "Villains who twirl their mustaches are easy to spot. Those who cloak themselves in good deeds are well camouflaged."

[(Anonymous)]

I mean... agreed about Joss but what does it matter in the context of the story? It was more about the most popular language/culture being the only thing left of old world in the future. I wouldn't have minded an all-Asian cast but I think the bigger reason was China's cultural influence being the strongest that humans in the future hold on to. Though if we're going by numbers it should be India and China.

[(Anonymous)]

I agree.

"White people" is a made-up category, and we don't really complain about a movie where people drink Champagne and eat brie and have French furniture but they are American and not French/lack French ancestry. Or if people in a movie based in Africa drink Coke and wear Levi's but aren't American. Brands are global now.

Certain cultures are influential in various areas and eras, and in Firefly's world, Chinese culture is the most influential, so it makes sense that people who are not ethnically Chinese would have Chinese stuff. The brands and styles are intergalactic.

But it would make sense to have some Chinese people cast, sure. But yeah, people in that world are influenced by China.

[(Anonymous)]

Hey now, there was that one lady in that one episode. I think she even had a line or two.

But seriously, given how few Asian actors were actually in it in any capacity, I wonder if there was deliberate exclusion.

[(Anonymous)]

Hot take here. I think that's actually the least problematic thing he's done. If China has become the globally dominant power, language and culture then you betcha ass every country is going to have its own way of incorporating that. But it doesn't mean it will be the same in China itself.

I find it way more offensive in, say, Independence Day 2 where we're subjected to an American take on China in the future (still needs rescuing by America of course yaaaawn).

America and Americans are sometimes better off just keeping to themselves and not sticking their extremely skewed views of the world into every other culture. Oh and then calling it woke to have done so.

[(Anonymous)]

Waaahhh the Americans are oppressing me and my free healthcare and my not having to worry about getting gunned down at school every day again!

[(Anonymous)]

? Not sure what you're having a meltdown about there.