[ SECRET POST #5321 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #5321 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 33 secrets from Secret Submission Post #762.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

This. Some people may say they genuinely want hard concrit from a friend but they really don't. Focus on specifics and little things that will improve their writing overall if they implement them, and as anon said above, steer them in the direction of well written books within that genre if you can.

[(Anonymous)]

I think most people who say they want concrit don't actually want it. At least, that's been my experience. IME, people ask for concrit but deep down, they don't actually think there are many flaws in their writing to concrit, so if it turns out that there are major issues... well. That really throws them for a loop and they react badly, because it feels like a betrayal.

This problem is exacerbated by the fact that most people don't know how to give concrit, and they don't know what issues a good beta/editor would be looking for, so they're unable to identify those issues in their own writing. It leads to a nasty surprise when they actually find a good beta who sees those flaws.

[(Anonymous)]

(Cozy werewolf anon)

I have to agree with this. Because I've done peer reviews and had people react... badly.

Like, -sigh- having been on both sides of this. there is the people don't know how to give good concrit side. like, my work has been called "unprofessional." Which is 100% not actionable. I can't do shit with that. And then once I dug into it with them, it turned out to be a... style preference issue. They wanted limited 3rd and to them that's the only "right" way to do things, and I write 3rd Omni. (This was literally their only issue outside of my pacing and slice of life is one of those things if you don't like it, you don't and i can't help you.)

Then on the other hand, there are really people who don't know/can't see the fundamentals of writing such as passive voice and show vs tell BALANCE or how plot structure/foreshadowing works. (Or genre conventions) And they surround themselves with people who ALSO don't know b/c there are lots of amateur writers out there, so when someone comes along and CAN point out with examples how their work could improve if they do X, Y, and Z. They aren't ready for it. It hurts! And instead of taking the advice (even if they asked for it) they lash out.

A good writer is also their harshest critic/editor. If not, they're most likely turning out dross. And so, before I took a break from this peer review stuff, if I couldn't give it 4 or 5 stars, I wouldn't review it because so many books weren't ready to be published. (It's not that they are bad. It's just they needed a few more rounds of editing, development and technical. Good luck getting indies to do that though.)

[(Anonymous)]

" And then once I dug into it with them, it turned out to be a... style preference issue."

Yeah, this is one of the ways people don't understand what issues to look for when they're editing. Too many people confuse "I like this" = good writing and "I don't like this" = bad writing and it's simply not the same thing at all. When I beta, whether or not I like the writing isn't really relevant. Do the writer's choices work for the story? Then that's good, regardless of whether or not I personally enjoyed it or found it entertaining.

Very few self-published writers get properly edited in terms of content. Very few self-pubbed writers want to pay for this service, so they exchange editing services with other self-pubbed writers and frankly... this is not necessarily a good or helpful route. Not everyone is cut out to be a developmental editor, you can't just nominate a random person who'll do it for free. This goes double for getting a fan to do it.

[(Anonymous)]

(Cozy Werewolf Anon)

You're right. In fact, the editor discourse on twitter is mind boggling distressing. They want spag and grammar and nothing else. When time and time again, I read the books (because I try damn it, I want to be supportive) and it's the story, the structure, and things that really take time and practice to develop like characterization and description that are the problems.

The reason I trust my editor (even though she is also self-pubbed) is because she does have a Master's Degree in this stuff. I trust her to not only give me a thing of grammatical issues to WORK on b/c my ADHD self needs it, and ALSO to be able to tell me IF something is going wrong what exactly it is. Is there enough tension? Did I set and resolve a conflict? Does this need to be shown and not summarized? Etc and so forth.

So many people want to write a book. That's great. And there is a huge excitement/temptation of when you write a book to publish it right away for the feedback. And that is not so great. OK if you're writing fanfic, not OK if you want people to pay money for your book. The irony is editing is feedback. It's just the kind that makes your writing better and might not stroke your ego.

As a dev editor, I have like NO clients b/c indie authors do not want to be told "you need to fix your structure and err, take out this HUGE bit of exposition. Have you NOT watched PotC?" But err... much more nicely. And also, pandemic. I'm refusing to push when people have very little money for things like... food and rent. And I'm confused if they think professional authors don't have those people? Because they do and professional editors that pitch to trad publishing houses ARE going to give huge structural edits if they see the need for them. (Apparently Butcher had this problem.)

My books aren't high art. They're just fun little adventures, and damn it, I get them edited!