[ SECRET POST #6168 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6168 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 36 secrets from Secret Submission Post #882.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

05. https://i.imgur.com/K3pbxnK.png

[ariakas]

Idk I kinda like the b!s part because nobody is the villain of their own narrative. Realistically, if the story were told from what is conventionally the villain's POV, the hero would be villainized. Since history is written by the victor, and heroes are almost always the victorious party in the stories told about them, there's probably a lot about their telling of events that is heavily skewed, or simply untrue. So I think this flavour of retelling is neat.

[(Anonymous)]

But romance is a part of life, and real-life villains usually do have romantic partners at some point. Like, Hitler had Eva Braun.

Also, if we're telling a tale from the perspective of the villain, the hero would come across badly, wouldn't they? That's the person opposing the villain, after all; he or she is bound to view them as the "bad guy" in their own story.

[(Anonymous)]

He wasn't supposed to be sympathetic.

His romance was toxic. His views were toxic. His friendships were toxic.

He's a horrible person. He was always a horrible person. He's depicted as a horrible person.

If you think the prequel exists to make him more sympathetic, you missed the point.

Showing reasons for a person ending up the way they did just adds reason for what they grew into, it doesn't necessarily make them sympathetic.

Wasn't that made clear enough with Gale? Or the final vote between the Victors in the main trilogy??

Disclaimer: I haven't watched the film, I read the book. He wasn't sympathetic at all. He was a whiner, he was shitty about his classmates, he was shitty to Sejanus, he felt a sense of ownership over Lucy Gray, he was icky from the start. He just wanted to win. It was social and financial.

[(Anonymous)]

I’m just here for the bonus secret. I never paid attention to anything about Wicked and was horribly disappointed when I saw it. Mediocre music, uninspired choreography, oh and yeah, the original hero is a villain and the villain is now a poor hapless victim whose actions were actually reactions and were misunderstood. I couldn’t be rolling my eyes any harder right now just thinking about it. And then at the end of the show they blocked all the exits with cast members holding out buckets for the kids in the audience to give to the Wicked anti-bullying charity. It was so gross.

[meadowphoenix]

I think part of the issue is that Wicked is an "adaption" of a book that basically reimagins Oz by grounding the fantasy world of Oz in real socio-political issues based on the way the original novel and movie depicts the world.

and the musical attempts to add songs and digestible lessons to what is a really dense and honestly odd anarcho-communist book.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, raising awareness against bullying real kids is gross because a musical you don't like villainized a fictional character who technically has never done anything good or bad because they don't really exist. Now I'm the one rolling my eyes.

And which hero are you even talking about? The Wizard? He wasn't a hero in the original. He wasn't as evil as in Wicked, but he was not as heroic as everyone thought, that was kind of the point. Or did you mean Glinda? In which case I think you just weren't paying attention.

[(Anonymous)]

Taking people hostage to force them to give you money is gross, that behavior is bad for the non-profit.

[tabaqui]

I got given the book to read as some kind of feminist...'thing' and loathed it utterly.

[(Anonymous)]

I hate the book, but I love the musical. The book is fake-deep and pretentious. The musical gets rid of those elements and is just a fun time.

[(Anonymous)]

I've only read the book and not seen the movie yet, but I never got the impression that the romance was meant to make him look sympathetic. On the contrary, I thought it showed that he's always been some degree of manipulative and toxic.

[feotakahari]

I think Cruella really poisoned the well here.

Props to Twisted, though. Good-guy Jafar sings about how he’ll always be remembered as a villain and the violent goon Aladdin will be a hero. Scar, Maleficent, and Captain Hook come onstage and sing about their justifications, and then Cruella comes on and they all recoil in horror.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think the prequel was intended to make him sympathetic; it was meant to show how he justifies the immoral things he does, and test our own approach to morality by forcing us to evaluate his actions and decide which of them we call good and which we call bad.

I don't find LG particularly interesting as a character, but I do think the romance plotline was an important part of the story, because it forced him into situations where he had to choose between his heart and (what he saw as) rationality. (so I guess what I'm saying is … it's a shame the romance wasn't with Sejanus 🤷)

[(Anonymous)]

+1, I think some prequels are designed to make villains sympathetic (or worse, precious angels who never did anything wrong!) but this is definitely not one of them.

[meadowphoenix]

A lot of emotionally twisted people understand very clearly what they should be like and as a character analysis, it is important to see how the "should" interacts with the "is". Romance and friendship are actually really good ways of showing that conflict because there technically is no universal "should" so it's a very revealing look at their worldview that you wouldn't get from his reactions to his family or his teachers alone.

[(Anonymous)]

eh I'm 300 pages in on the book, and he's already the building blocks of what he becomes. Paranoid, possessive, angry, disinterested in real bonds with people he thinks are beneath him. I think they did a good job in the book of showing what kind of person he was that led into what he became.

The movie, not as great.

[(Anonymous)]

It's almost like people don't realize that The Ballad is a villain origin story. Snow isn't supposed to look sympathetic, not even with Lucy. He's supposed to look like a villain who descends deeper into the villainity with every choice he makes.