[ SECRET POST #6248 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6248 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 24 secrets from Secret Submission Post #893.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

I don't quite follow your logic and reasoning here. Like, how did it change shipping or user entitlement? Those things have been around forever. Anyone want to try and explain?

[kaijinscendre]

I've not a clue. Hopefully OP comes to explain. I don't see how Ao3 differs from a site like FF.net.

[(Anonymous)]

Not OP

I found the ff.net made it a bit more difficult to find explicit fics (and in fact these stories were a bit more discouraged in ff.net's TOS, if I remember correctly). I feel like the culture and mindset of ff.net users was a bit snootier and more favorable to those who adhered to more canon details. Plus tagging/tag abuse is less of a thing there.

[(Anonymous)]

I found the ff.net made it a bit more difficult to find explicit fics

FIFY

[(Anonymous)]

I think that's totally fandom dependent.

[(Anonymous)]

It also made it impossible to find queer fics in general. I remember a m/m fic I had bookmarked disappeared following a porn purge and the worst it had was... Making out.

[(Anonymous)]

That's because explicit fic was banned on that site in 2002, and every fic labeled NC-17 was deleted. It was becoming very high-profile and they were concerned about being sued.

[(Anonymous)]

Are you sure it was in 2002? I remember reading very depraved m/m stuff on ffnet around 2005.

[(Anonymous)]

I looked it up, and I was around them. Was the fic you read officially rated NC-17 or just Mature? Because what they did was eliminate the entire NC-17 category and delete everything in it. People sneak their explicit fic in by labeling it Mature, and the site moderators don't really check as far as I can tell.

[(Anonymous)]

This is why content bans are stupid. People will deliberately mislabel their fic to get around the ban and then people will run into things that are triggering, or are explicit when they didn't want to see that, etc etc etc. Don't ban the content, fic gets appropriately labeled, people who want to avoid it can avoid it. Win-win-win.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh people definitely still posted smut on there even after the NC-17 rating was removed, hence why the lemon/lime labeling back in the day as a code for 'here be smut.'

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, FFN banned MA (NC-17) around 2002. I remember because I had to move my sexually gory shit to AFFN.

And like others pointed out, some writers snuck in things anyway.

[(Anonymous)]

When AO3 was new, the consensus as I remember it seemed to be that the fic quality was overall higher there. ff.net, meanwhile, was full of lolrandom fics, author's notes interrupting the prose to tell the reader the author's thoughts on specific characters (or possibly just what they ate today), written out conversations between the author and the characters in the fic, and so on. We called it the Pit of Voles. It’s not that there were no good writers on ff.net, just that it was where most of baby's first fanfic got posted at the time.

Of course as fandom at large moved onto AO3, all the inexperienced and less dedicated writers now flocked there (and more recently wattpad I guess), so the userbase on ff.net is now on average older and more experienced.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah I’m clueless as to how AO3 started anything new regarding shipping. Ship wars are a tale as old as time.

[(Anonymous)]

AO3 became a thing around the same time as the first popular social media, which allowed fans to have direct access to the creators and authors and actors of their favorite media, which has led to fans being more entitled to the time, attention, and consideration of said creators and authors and actors, which has led fans to being more entitled to the time, attention, and consideration of fanfic authors. OP assumes that since it all happened after AO3 it is because of AO3, which is a logistical fallacy.

[(Anonymous)]

But Ao3 has LESS contact with authors. There is no way to directly message authors (AFAIK) the same way you could on community pages like live journal or even fanfiction.net. That may be the OP's logic but it is stupid logic.

[(Anonymous)]

Exactly. There's no way AO3 has caused any kind of entitlement. It's just an archive. It's like saying libraries cause entitlement among book readers. Like wut.

[(Anonymous)]

I get your point but I think your dates might be a little off.

[(Anonymous)]

AO3 was established in 2008. The like button was introduced to facebook in 2009, twitter won "breakout of the year" in 2009, instagram was launched in 2010.

The dates check out.

[(Anonymous)]

They might have been introduced then but they didn't really take off in those years so idk if you can really consider them influential by those dates.

[(Anonymous)]

Twitter absolutely took off in 2008. From wiki:

April 2007 – October 2008 Twitter grows rapidly under CEO Jack Dorsey, completing two funding rounds and launching official support for hashtags.
October 2008 – October 2010 Jack Dorsey steps down, and Evan Williams takes over as CEO. Twitter raises money, gets celebrity endorsements and publicity, and continues to grow rapidly.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm pretty sure people were into Facebook well before 2008. And MySpace even earlier.

[(Anonymous)]

People were there, but it wasn't popular until around 2008. It was created in 2004, but it took until 2008 for facebook to break the 100 million user mark, and then made it to 200 million by 2009. Myspace was in its decline around 2009.