[ SECRET POST #6405 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6405 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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07. [SPOILERS for House of the Dragon]




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08. [SPOILERS for Centaurworld]




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09. [WARNING for discussion of both real life and fictional rape/sexual assault]




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10. [WARNING for discussion of Neil Gaiman/sexual assault allegations]







































Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 00 secrets from Secret Submission Post #915.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

First, FS doesn't have a hateboner for fic reviews as in comments; it has a hateboner for Goodreads reviews, the long-form critiques of fics modeled after long-form critiques of published fiction.

Second, sure, a writer can write whatever they feel like writing in their AN. And readers can dislike what a writer has said in their AN, and decide to stop reading the fic. You writing a whole whopping two thousand words doesn't entitle you to readership, or to comments. People are allowed to give your fic a pass. They're allowed to dislike it. They're allowed to decide it isn't worth the time it takes to leave a comment. If you can't handle that; if the thought of putting in all of that effor and then having your work land with a dull thud upsets you so much that you feel the need to start trying to shame people into providing you with accolades, then it might be time to find a new hobby.

Third, I don't think you understand why people comment. It isn't because someone has asked them in the correct way; it's because they enjoyed what they read and felt moved to say something about it. Honest engagement with a piece happens when it's a piece worth engaging with, and a threatening AN is likely to make people think that it isn't.

[(Anonymous)]

You've read a lot of 'please leave a comment' in your time.

[(Anonymous)]

+1000

[(Anonymous)]

"Third, I don't think you understand why people comment. It isn't because someone has asked them in the correct way; it's because they enjoyed what they read and felt moved to say something about it."

This is exactly why I comment on so few fics: because there are very few fics that move me enough to make me want to tell the author this. It's the same with most media for me - I consume tons of tv shows/movies/books/games/etc., but most of them are just okay to me and I don't feel any particular way about them beyond "this was an enjoyable way to spend some time."

[(Anonymous)]

Same, besides the fact that I'm generally an unemotional person, it's not like I review TV shows or movies I watch, and the hundreds of unreviewed Steam games on my account would prove I don't rate or review games I play either. When mobile apps beg me to leave ratings, I don't, and if they keep begging for one every 5 minutes even after being told "no" I give it a 2 or 3 regardless of quality because the user experience is deliberately awful.

I probably leave far more kudos and comments on fanwork, proportionately, than professional media. But it takes a lot, or a very good fic, to get me to do so, and probably lots of people are similar. If I don't leave one, what I would've said was "eh, it was alright, could've been better, okay time waster, nothing too original, 3/5" and I don't think that comment would be necessarily appreciated.

If people really need to look at a number to feel better, put in a hit counter or look at hits. Idgi

[(Anonymous)]

Same anon as ^

I do write fic btw. It's nice when people comment, but I don't care if they don't. The best comments are the ones like "I usually never comment but this was so good I had to" anyway, and just-asking is never going to get you those. Idk git gud

[(Anonymous)]

I do wonder about the third point, though. I know YouTubers who started the whole "please subscribe" dance because their analytics show that it actually does boost their subscriptions when they do it Vs when they don't.

I'm not sure why that is (do we as an audience forget that subscribing is ana option if we aren't reminded????) but if it works that way for YouTube I wonder if it might work the same for docs and that's why authors keep doing it.

[(Anonymous)]

To answer your question, yes! People who are watching a channel they just found often forget subscribing is an option, or take a while to determine whether they want to subscribe or not. When reminded later on, they go "oh yeah they should consider that, since they've been watching a bunch of these now, haven't they?" and hit subscribe.

I don't think it works as much for authors, though, unless they're writing multichaptered fic with a reminder every time, the same way youtube channels work. Almost nobody subscribes to a whole channel for a one-off video, and random reminders "to subscribe/comment" doesn't get people to subscribe in general to other random channels.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think it works the same for comments, as comments require time and thought, whereas liking and subscribing just requires clicking a couple of buttons on the screen.

It may work for "kudos," since that's a single click. But you're always going to see fewer comments than "kudos" (just as, on YouTube, there are always fewer comments than "likes" and subscriptions), just because leaving a comment is by nature harder to do.

[(Anonymous)]

So how many words someone has to read for writer to get a comment? Is 10K enough for a writer to be entitled to a feedback? 50K?
I really don't get your second point. It takes 5 hours to read a long fic, and suddenly it's not worth 2 minutes to leave a comment. Do you hate read?

[(Anonymous)]

There is no amount of words written that entitles a writer to get a comment. A writer is never entitled to a comment; that's the point.

Part of putting fic out there is accepting the possibility that no one read it or no one will like it. People cannot and should not be forced or cajoled into enjoying or engaging with our work, no matter how much time and effort we put in. And trying to do so usually negatively impacts the reception of the work.

[(Anonymous)]

What's more negative of a reception than not leaving a review? What could a reader do? Don't read? A writer doesn't care because there's no feedback anyway. Flames? Why should a writer care about negative reception among people that leave no feedback? Should a writer be happy that somewhere far away someone whispered 'Nice fic'.

I comment all the time and I do not understand why people keep repeating that they read a fic they don't like. If I read a fic I liked it enough to read it. No one held me hostage and made me read it.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

Sometimes you're bored and read a lot of fic and most of it isn't good and you're just doing it because you're bored and its like 4 AM.

You don't have to hate a fic to not like it, lots can be and are merely mediocre.

[(Anonymous)]

Do you magically know ahead of time whether you'll like a fic?

People read fics they don't like because they don't know whether they'll like them without reading them. I feel you like you understand this, but are pretending you don't for the sake of argument.

[(Anonymous)]

A writer doesn't care because there's no feedback anyway.

Anon, this entire discussion is about writers feeling entitled to comments. That means they do, in fact, care. They care so much they write author's notes asking people to comment and entire blog posts about how they're owed comments in exchange for their fic.

People don't like being told what to do, and they don't like feeling like they're obligated to do something. So if someone wants comments, they might shoot themselves in the foot by begging for them.

[(Anonymous)]

This is the hard part about being creative in public: you are not owed feedback, be it good or bad.

I still think the constant comment wank is really about community, but that's a different discussion, I think.

[(Anonymous)]

ayrt
I don't want writers for my unpopular ships to have it hard. I want to hype them up. I started reading on FFN where 'please update' reviews were pretty normal.