Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2011-03-21 03:55 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2011-03-21 03:55 pm
[ SECRET POST #1539 ]
⌈ Secret Post #1539 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 213 secrets from Secret Submission Post #220.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
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(Anonymous) 2011-03-21 08:36 pm (UTC)(link)no subject
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Even if she didn't have a crush on him, that shit would get old fast and she was bound to feel like the leftover choice.
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Sorry but in S3, Ten was a bit of a dick to her. "Rose would know." Oh, GTFO.
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I don't think I've come to dislike Ten as much as I did until I got to this season. Given all the awesome companions he's had, including Sarah Jane Smith, I never quite understood his infatuation for Rose. Mind you, I like Rose and all, but I still think he gave her too much credit than she actually warranted, especially since other companions have proven to hold their own.
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(Anonymous) 2011-03-21 11:49 pm (UTC)(link)no subject
I mean at first I had no problems with how sad he was over losing her. Fair play, she was his first companion since the Time War and they had grown very close. Anyone would be crushed at losing someone like that in a way they'd never see them again. I even let the broody mention of her in The Runaway Bride pass. But then S3 came and...he STILL wouldn't shut up about her. Making out like she was the best thing since sliced bread (Sliced Bread still being my favorite DW companion).
And...why?
"Coz he was in love with her!" Ok....Why? What made her so much different from Victoria? Or Jo? Or Sarah Jane? Or Peri? Or Ace? Granted, they all have different personalities but they're all the same trope as Rose. The human girl with the mundane life whisked away to a series of big adventures that open her eyes up the bigger world. Or the "90's Disney Princess"", if you want the shorter name. There was nothing wrong with Rose, there was just nothing spectacular about her that made it fair for Ten to make Martha feel so inferior - especially considering Martha had more brains, ambition and compassion than Rose seemed ever seemed to.
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I don't really consider this a suitable reason why he shouldn't have been in love with Rose. Maybe she wasn't as clever or compassionate or ambitious as his other previous companions but people fall in love with people all the time and it often has nothing to do with how they "measure up" to other people. To say that she somehow wasn't worthy of his love because she wasn't anything special invalidates not only the love they shared but love in general. Because no matter how average a person may seem to an outside party or how much they're "just like a ton of other people," they're the moon and the stars to the person who loves them and that person sees them as special.
Of course, this doesn't mean that he was justified in treating Martha like he did because he was a dick to her and he deserved a good slap at various points during that season. But saying "IDK why he even loved Rose. She wasn't even anything special" is just a terrible thing to say about someone's love relationship.
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Why he was in love with Rose in the first place is another matter entirely. Either way it happened and no confusion or bemusement from me will change that so, screw it.
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I think this has more to do with her being the first one there after all the trauma of the Time War and helping him to overcome all that severe guilt and depression than it has to do with her not getting kidnapped as much/being more helpful/not getting in as much trouble as anyone else. (Donna serves a similar role in helping 10 to get over the loss of Rose, etc and he even refers to her as his "best friend." He doesn't say that about anyone else. He puts her on her own pedestal. A big difference is that he wasn't in love with her the way he was with Rose.)
The fact that he says "Rose would know" was a mixture of that and the fact that he was in love with her so he automatically elevated her to a higher place than anyone else, as people in love are wont to do. In turn, that made Martha feel like crap and, like I said, he deserved a slap for that. Not for thinking Rose was something better than anyone else but for actively behaving in such a way that he made someone else feel like less.
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You've just won it all.
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(Anonymous) 2011-03-21 11:24 pm (UTC)(link)no subject
The problem is that people rail and rail and rail for realistic characters--and yes, I am going to pull this card--most notably realistic female characters, because of how frequently female characters are either treated horribly or disgustingly idealized in fiction. Then, when we get characters that actually have flaws, there are fifty different reasons why you should dislike them, fifty reasons why they're a Mary Sue, and fifty-one and a half reasons why they are bad portrayals of women. How dare she have a crush? Normal women don't get irrational crushes on attractive men!
I have been in fandom for years, and I have never ever ever ever heard anyone criticize a male character for being a little jealous--even the male characters who are being absolute asshats and letting their jealousy get in the way of productivity--[in fact, most often jealous guys are seen as ~hot] yet I can't count the times when I've seen girls hated on for even perceived jealousy. It's fucking dumb. Martha had every reason to be jealous in that situation and she didn't even go over the top with it, and yet there are still people who dislike her purely over this small fact. I'd be willing to bet that if she hadn't gotten jealous, people would be accusing her of being a doormat or something equally dumb.
Either you goddamn want characters that act like human beings, or you goddamn don't.
/steps off the motherfucking soapbox
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DA
(Anonymous) 2011-03-22 12:48 am (UTC)(link)Hell, it would have taken a saint to not get jealous in that situation, considering the fact that Ten was treating her like a rebound companion. You don't have to have a crush on someone to be annoyed when they treat you like second best.
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+1,000,000,000
Re: +1,000,000,000
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