Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2012-01-13 07:20 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2012-01-13 07:20 pm
[ SECRET POST #1837 ]
⌈ Secret Post #1837 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
01.
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02. [broken link]
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03.
[Robin Of Sherwood/Michael Praed]
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04.
[Glee]
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05.
[We Got Married - Ga In (Brown Eyed Girls)/Jo Kwon (2AM)]
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06.
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07.
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08.
[Buzz Lightyear of Star Command]
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09. http://i.imgur.com/8DbqS.png
[linked for nudity/kind of porny]
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10.
[Josh Groban and Andrea Bocelli]
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11.
[Beast Wars, Megatron]
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12.
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13.
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14.
[Magic Mike]
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15.
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16. [repeat]
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17.
[Harry Potter & Little House on the Prairie]
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18.
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19.
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20.
[X-Men: First Class]
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21.
[Death Note]
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22.
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23.
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24.
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[ ----- SPOILERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]
25. [SPOILERS for something, OP did not specify]
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26. [SPOILERS for Vampire Hunter D]
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27. [SPOILERS for Christmas Doctor Who and New Year's Sherlock]
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[ ----- TRIGGERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]
28. [TRIGGER WARNING for rape]
[SPOILERS for Loveless]
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29. [TRIGGER WARNING for abuse]
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30. [TRIGGER WARNING for rape]
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31. [TRIGGER WARNING for rape, animal cruelty]
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Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #262.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
no subject
Killing like this is devoid of humanity? I wish. But not every person who committed these crimes are psychopaths/sociopaths. They weren't devoid of humanity. If that were the case there would be no need to question why happened. Humans did this, normal humans.
And I would say that the construction of justifications and or rationale behind these kind of crimes is what make them unique and interesting to study. It's not all the same and it's not a bunch of monsters killing people. Regardless of how wrong it is, is not as simple as that.
no subject
"Killing like this is devoid of humanity? I wish. But not every person who committed these crimes are psychopaths/sociopaths. They weren't devoid of humanity. If that were the case there would be no need to question why happened. Humans did this, normal humans."
It is. To be able to kill another person, someone has to shut off their compassion entirely for that moment. The thing to study here is what exactly makes someone willing to do that. Sometimes, in cases of a murder of a single person, it happens for pretty normal and human reasons. A jilted lover, someone who's been abused finally fighting back against their attacker, some sort of escalated fight or feud, etc. But when it's no longer on a personal level, but rather an attack on an entire group, it's pretty much never understandable within human emotion. To murder people solely for a group they belong to is to dehumanize them, and to do that to such an extent to be willing to kill them is to dehumanize yourself, if just temporarily.
no subject
I don't agree. History show us very compassionate people who are able to kill hundreds due to religious and/or ideological conviction, not to mention plain old fear. Also, I think that dehumanising the people responsible of these crimes (unless they are, in fact, psychopaths) is making them less guilty. Maybe I don't understand "being human" as you do? I don't think it's 100% good thing: I see people as being a mix of goodness and evil and mediocrity.
no subject
...In other words, you think the perceptions are right. Look. There are two different levels to look at here; the perception that people have and what the actual truth is. They are separate matters and need to be treated as such. To say that what the Nazis did is perceived as worse than other genocides (or "on a different level" if you must insist on that wording, but stop playing games with me, you know as well as I do that it's synonymous with "worse") is fine, but it's not the same as saying what the Nazis did was worse than other genocides ("on a different level", what the fuck ever). The latter is honestly offensive IMO, as it downplays the tragedy of the lives lost in other genocides.
"I don't agree. History show us very compassionate people who are able to kill hundreds due to religious and/or ideological conviction, not to mention plain old fear. Also, I think that dehumanising the people responsible of these crimes (unless they are, in fact, psychopaths) is making them less guilty. Maybe I don't understand "being human" as you do? I don't think it's 100% good thing: I see people as being a mix of goodness and evil and mediocrity."
No, humans aren't all good, and I never said that, but to actually take another's life is crossing a line unlike just about any other crime a person can commit. To be able to do it even once and not be wracked with guilt over it after the fact is to kill a bit of your own humanity. To be able to kill mass numbers of people, be it directly or indirectly or both, and not only not feel guilty, but to justify it? It's inhuman. It doesn't matter why it's done. There's a reason why so many religions and other schools of moral thought regard murder as the greatest sin or crime. Taking another's life is a horrid thing to do, and anyone being desensitized to it enough to have hundreds, thousands, millions, etc of people put to death is really fucking scary. It doesn't matter if the reason behind it is science or blood purity or religion or whatever else. Honestly, I think it's scariest when the driving force is religion, myself.
Just. To actually believe what the Nazis did was worse is extremely fucked up. Anything in which so many lives are lost is a horrible tragedy, and comparing them to decide which is "worse" is fucking disgusting.
no subject
There are not enough internets to award you right now.
no subject
I think that perception is what makes people more sensitive to one than to the other.
Look. There are two different levels to look at here; the perception that people have and what the actual truth is. They are separate matters and need to be treated as such. To say that what the Nazis did is perceived as worse than other genocides (or "on a different level" if you must insist on that wording, but stop playing games with me, you know as well as I do that it's synonymous with "worse") is fine, but it's not the same as saying what the Nazis did was worse than other genocides ("on a different level", what the fuck ever). The latter is honestly offensive IMO, as it downplays the tragedy of the lives lost in other genocides.
Agreed. But perception is what makes people react differently, so perception is the interesting thing to discuss.
No, it's not a synonym and I didn't mean it like that. It's not my place to judge what's worse and I really don't need to. I am interested on the reasons why this perception is so widespread. I never said that what the Nazis did is worse. The OP was mad about people considering the Nazis worse than the Soviet Union and I think there are reasons why this is so common in the Western. The fact that there are reasons has nothing to do with the immorality of the act itself but how people reacted to it.
Again, I don't have any need to say what's worse because the lost of human lives is a regrettable event every time and genocide is unjustifiable every time. But that is not what I am talking about, even if you don't want to believe me.
If anything, it would be useful to understand the impact of the Holocaust in our collective conscience and to try to develop more awareness about the Soviet crimes.
I would like yo agree with you but history is filled with normal people who kill without feeling guilt. Many of of heroes killed without a speck of guilt. I agree that's scary and inconceivable and that's why, in our times, when it happens it is so baffling. But I can't agree that it's beyond humanity to do so because that's making things simpler than they are.
I'll give an example: the Crusade against the Cathars. The people who murder thousands of innocent people were absolutely convinced that they were right and that they were doing God's will. They were perfectly normal humans who, in that particular context committed an horrendous crime. To think of them as beyond humanity is to miss the chance to understand why it happened and learn from it.
The same with the Nazis. The vast majority of them were normal, non-psychopathic humans. And yet they did what they did. It can't be attributed to personal reasons, there has to be something else there, something that we can dissect.
no subject
In 1995, there was a terrible bombing in my country, the biggest terrorist attack in the history of my country. It was paid and organised by Iran and targeted against a Jewish organization. It changed our society. From a moral POV it was a s horrid as the 9/11 even if very few people died in comparison. But the 9/11 is in another level when it comes to people's perception because of where it happened and what it meant.