[ SECRET POST #1901 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1901 ⌋


Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 150 secrets from Secret Submission Post #272.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 - broken links ], [ 1 2 3 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Comments

[tw-31988.livejournal.com]

oh.

[(Anonymous)]

Other charming and considerate quotes include:

""Multiculturalism hasn't and doesn't help, because rightly or wrongly it polarises people so much," he continues. "Racism is one thing - and I don't agree with that in any form - but noticing that there are differences is normal and fine and to be encouraged.

"We've reached a state now where it's, 'You shouldn't notice. Why are you noticing he's got a bomb and has a beard and is Muslim and wants to kill your family?"

"There is no country in the world like this. If all of a sudden all the traffic wardens in Ghana were Welsh, they'd really notice and might not love it? We give ourselves a hard time in this country in a sort of mea culpa way. But if we were that racist, people wouldn't come. Very simple.""

+

""I really liked hip-hop until the gangsta rap took over. I come from a time when not every rap record was 'nigga' this and 'nigga' that; an earlier socially and morally conscious hip-hop sensibility, when it was, 'Don't call people nigga'."

"But now it's nigga, nigga, nigga, and it's not funny or interesting politically, artistically or socially. I really don't like it.""

and of course:

""Without the suffragettes a lot of women would have thought, 'Why should we have the vote?' And I think that the same argument exists today. People should stand up and be counted.""

:)

[(Anonymous)]

I wish people would stop posting those quotes out of context.

[(Anonymous)]

Context to be found in the second comment. Or here:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-563570/Martin-Freeman-life-shouldnt-just-day-office.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-563570/Martin-Freeman-life-shouldnt-just-day-office.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-563570/Martin-Freeman-life-shouldnt-just-day-office.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-563570/Martin-Freeman-life-shouldnt-just-day-office.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-563570/Martin-Freeman-life-shouldnt-just-day-office.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-563570/Martin-Freeman-life-shouldnt-just-day-office.html

[writerserenyty.livejournal.com]

It's the Daily Mail, though; it's not like they're known for good journalism. It's a tabloid newspaper.

Not saying anything regarding Martin Freeman, but IMO things taken from the Daily Mail need to be taken with a sizable grain of salt.

[misco.livejournal.com]

WTF is this gross shit?

MF can go fuck himself.

[(Anonymous)]

I thought the argument over the n-word was disapproving of it, though. As in, he doesn't think it's appropriate to use that word, considering its historical background.

[(Anonymous)]

I get that, but extremely often in rap music, it's used as a reclaimed slur, and as a white guy, it's not really his place to decide whether or not it's appropriate. (And thus suggesting it isn't is ignorant and priviledged.)

Similarly, I identify as queer or dyke and despite the historical connotations of those terms, it's okay for me to use them, because I'm a LGBTQ person reappropriating an offensive term. It is still offensive if a straight person calls me that, unless I've personally okayed it. And a straight person is not in the place to say whether or not it's appropriate for me to use those words about myself.

[jak-frostty.livejournal.com]

it's not really his place to decide whether or not it's appropriate

But he never said anything about it being appropriate or not. All he said was his opinion that he didn't enjoy it.

[Gangsta rap]'s not funny or interesting politically, artistically or socially. I really don't like it.

That is all personal opinion, not social critique.

I personally don't like polka. I don't find it interesting, pleasant to listen to, or socially relevant. Does that mean I think it's inappropriate? My mom's side of the family is going to have words with me soon if that was the case.

[(Anonymous)]

No, you can not like any music and it doesn't mean it's inappropriate. It's fine if he doesn't like gangsta rap. Or rap in general. Or opera. Or any music whatsoever. That's not the issue.

This is what I was replying to: "he doesn't think it's appropriate to use that word, considering its historical background."

[jak-frostty.livejournal.com]

Ah. Sorry missed that!

[(Anonymous)]

I agree that an 'outsider' can't make claims about which words you can or cannot use for yourself. It's ok for him to dislike rap music and to dislike it for that particular reason, but he should leave it alone.

I'm not sure about this bit though:
Similarly, I identify as queer or dyke and despite the historical connotations of those terms, it's okay for me to use them, because I'm a LGBTQ person reappropriating an offensive term. It is still offensive if a straight person calls me that, unless I've personally okayed it.

I agree that no one should be calling you those things unless you're ok with it. But he wasn't 'calling' anyone the n-word. He was quoting, I suppose. I had an English lit professor who taught a class on 'Beloved'. One of the themes is slavery and the n-word is used a lot. He would quote from the text so we could discuss it. Back home in Europe, no one batted an eye. In the US when he was a guest lecturer, he had someone come and tell him this was a terrible faux pas. The only reason no students had spoken up and no one really blamed him was because they knew he was foreign. When he told us this story, we were all shocked. We knew the n-word was bad, we would never call anyone that, but it was in the text.

I think it might be something like this.

[(Anonymous)]

I was only referring to the above comment and not the interview itself. I meant queer/dyke as another example of reappropriation and why it's okay for marginalized groups to use terms that have offensive connotations. I did not mean to imply that he would have used the n-word in any other way except saying "these songs use that particular term a lot".

The anon I was replying to made the assumption that "he doesn't think it's appropriate to use that word, considering its historical background" and if we proceed from there, I wanted to point out that reclaimed terms do not function the same way as they do in the previous context. I apologise my poor wording. My intention was never to say that him using the n-word in the interview was racist or mean-spirited (since it can be seen as a quote). I intended to simply give another example of reclaimed words and how they work, since I know little about the reappropriation of the n-word, whereas I have personal experience with terms like queer/dyke. I simply meant that someone calling me a dyke or a queer would be offensive, just as someone calling a PoC the n-word would be offensive, while it's fine for me to refer to myself as queer/dyke and a PoC to themselves as n-word. I didn't mean that his comment should be taken as that kind of an insult.

And yes, I've also had a class on Beloved in Europe and the n-word was used in no way offensively. So I agree with you completely!

[(Anonymous)]

You ever called anyone fat for any reason whatsoever? Plenty of people do it to me all the time. And I'm not fat because I overeat. It's a medical condition. Plenty of people (god how many!) presume to tell me how/why I should lose weight. Skinny/not sick people who've never been fat a day in their lives. My point is this: Plenty of people voice their opinions on subjects they have no personal experience with. I don't think Martin was being racists or homophobic, I think he was being what everyone else is today: opinionated on something he (maybe) shouldn't have an opinion on.

[(Anonymous)]

No, I most certainly do not. I've been called fat, though. And dyke and weirdo and ugly and queer, etc. etc. I don't call other people by slurs because it sucks. I know people do that out of ignorance. They don't always mean to be mean and sometimes they do. I have never once said that his comments are racist or homophobic. I've said they're ignorant and poorly worded. For example, in the comment you're replying to I said:
"My intention was never to say that him using the n-word in the interview was racist or mean-spirited (since it can be seen as a quote)."

I was simply trying to explain to anon why, if we assume that he doesn't like gangsta rap because he thinks the use of the n-word is inappropriate (which is the anon's assumption and the interview doesn't have to be read that way, but I am replying to anon's assumption), that's problematic because a person who doesn't belong to a particular marginalized group isn't in the place to say whether or not it's appropriate for that group to use reclaimed slurs. Still basing on anon's assumption that he expressed his dislike because he thought it to be inappropriate, it doesn't mean he'd be racist or homophobic (which I have never once said he'd be), it just means that he doesn't have a very good understanding of reappropriated slurs. Which is fine, but it is problematic. But perhaps he didn't mean it that way at all.

[(Anonymous)]

Serious question. So... though queer is appended to LGBTQ regularly, it is still not an acceptable label for straight folk to use? I was under the impression that it had long since been reclaimed and was to the point that it was, like...a label, the way "gay" is a label or "lesbian" is a label. Just a thing to be. Or "genderqueer." No?

[(Anonymous)]

DA

I think it depends on the person. I'm perfectly fine with other, non-queer people referring to me as queer, but it really depends on context. If someone I know really well, who's aware of my sexuality and the labels I feel comfortable using for myself calls me queer, I'm perfectly fine with that. However, if someone I didn't know as well, and therefore didn't really know their intentions, were to refer to me as queer, I'd probably be less okay with it because I wouldn't be sure where they were coming from. There are still a lot of non-queer people who aren't really aware that the word has been reclaimed and some of the connotations of that, after all, and it was a slur for a very, very long time. There are also still a lot of LGBTQ people who do not like the word and are not comfortable having it used in reference to themselves. So, personally, I think it's okay to refer to queer people in general, if you're talking about the group, but when you're referring to an individual person, always ask what they self-label as (if they are even comfortable with labels at all) and what they're comfortable being called. Other people may take a different stance of course, but that's just the way I look at it.

[pendingprogress.livejournal.com]

Genuine question (which I think is going to come out as sounding facetious online no matter how I word it, so this is the disclaimer): if someone calls you say, queer or a dyke, and you don't know their sexual orientation, how do you know how to feel? Say it's some random person you've just met, or someone online, and you're talking about maybe sexual orientations and then they go, "Well yeah, you're a dyke, blah blah blah," and they don't seem to be intending to be offensive but then you don't know what their orientation is...how do you take it?

Pic