fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2000 ]

[ SECRET POST #2000 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2000 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 110 secrets from Secret Submission Post #286.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ], [ 1 2 - posted twice ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

bwuh what

Loki is like one of the most sympathetic male gods in the entire Norse mythology, at least compared to the others.

Uh, what? What? Have we read the same myths or has Tom Hiddleston blinded everyone?

He triggered the murdered Baldr, of the nicest of gods, caused the death of that nice god's brother, Hodr, after having made him kill Baldr. He robbed Freyja for no real good reason. He taunted Skadi about having murdered her father when it wasn't true. He cut Sif's hair because he could. He got others entangled in things they didn't sign up for. Over and over, he did nasty things and triggered arguments. He even cheated on his loyal, steadfast wife Sigyn. It was said his children with Angrboda were dangerous especially because of him. The story about Slepinir and how he ended up Odin's possession? Shows how little Loki cared. Loki is not known to bite his tongue and he didn't protest giving up his son.

Loki's a first-class jackass who ruined any chances of a good relationship, had an extremely arrogant look on life, thought himself able to get away with anything and his punishment with the snake was JUSTICE. Don't get me wrong, the other Aesir were terrible. Odin, especially. But Loki was unrepentant for the misery and insults he threw out.

To sympathize with him means you missed the point of all the myth stories involving him. Feel sorry for his children who were trapped or ripped apart but not Loki. He got everything he deserved.

I'm sorry for the length of this but I'm just baffled with you right now.

You are cognisant of the fact that many people portray/see Loki sympathetically that have NOTHING to do with Hiddleston?

Not only the long tradition of worshipping trickster figures, but many authorial interpretations?

Seems you got your own interpretation going on, good for you!

Majority do. I felt it warranted pointing out.

LOL please go read the Eddas again. :) They are all that matter, not 'interpretations'. But, hey, go soften up one of Norse myths most fantastic characters and make him something wibbly and sorrowful. You fangirls just love your emokids. I'm sure it makes him more relatable instead of real!

Oh dear... you're obsessed with the idea that it's a "fangirl" thing, aren't you? I'm sure your views have hardened against that.

My point is that it's not.

SA Also, by "sympathetic" I don't mean "good", you know... you can do bad shit and still be relateable for various reasons. And not in a woobie way either.

Um...I'm not going to say he's the good guy in the myths, because he definitely isn't, but he IS a trickster figure. Trickster figures basically exist to fuck shit up, to make people think, to provide morals (good or bad). I always thought of him as morally gray.

Yeah, exactly. Which can make tricksters an appealing character, both a villain and hero, depending upon what they're doing at the time, and having done to them at the time.

Loki does a lot of shit other people don't deserve, but he also cops a lot of shit too, not always entirely deserved. And things blow up in his face, where he's forced to do bad things just to survive, or help someone else... it's kind of farcical how the fates work in the myths.

PLUS COMIC RELIEF

They said "compared to the others" who were mostly assholes themselves. Loki got what he deserved, but the other assholes didn't except when Loki played some prank on them.

I remember being pretty peeved as a kid that they could call Odin a god of wisdom with all the shit he did! And they always got away with it because they were cruel to the weak, even to children. Loki never got away with this shit because he pulled it on people as strong as he was, and for being an equal-opportunity asshole I liked him best.

No, he's not a woobie but there's context and the context is that he sucks the least and got reamed the hardest. He deserved it (why Baldr of all people?) but did his kid deserve to get killed to be used as chains? No. And who did that to him? Who pulls all this shit and never paid for it until the literal end of time?

This is why I like Marvel better than actual Norse Mythology. When Loki is the best guy around, you have problems.

No one in Norse myth is clean. But I refuse to acknowledge that Loki is sympathetic. It grates me personally that a good trickster characters like him, an utter asshole who got what he deserved, is reduced to 'poor Loki!' and all that.

Sympathetic villain, or character, as someone you could root for in a story and see their POV, is not the same as woobie. (It's been done in many stories about Loki.) Repeat after me.

The Asatru I know who identify as Lokismen and Lokiswomen did so long before the films came out. If you want to argue with them about the 'true meaning' of the Eddas, so be it - I'm aware that not all Heathens agree about him (given his job, it'd be surprising if they did) - but I'm quite sure they've done the reading.

You'd be surprised how little new pagans read about their religion or make any sort of research. It's usually mouth to mouth stuff and doctrines between groups which is really sad. Really, they use mostly someone else's interpretation.

Luckily I know few neo pagans who are not neonazi and few of them actually does research.

You so right gurrrrrl. Plus he's a kyriarchal rapist doncha know: http://myfuckingspiritualityblog.tumblr.com/post/25253822619/why-i-am-not-working-with-loki

Dude, what if that's guy?

Guuurrrrrlllll goes beyond gender, it's an attitude.

*flicks non-existent hair*

I grew up with Norse legends, actually. It was one of my favorite hobbies as a child. Apologies for the length.

So, okay, I'm gonna start with how mythologies related to Loki tend to change. A lot. Sometimes, he's one of the nicer gods, while sometimes he's an outright asshole. But I, personally, have always found him at least a little symphathetic. A lot more symphathetic than the other male gods, actually. The biggest problem is that there's no "one version that rules them all".
There's a common theme in all of the versions. He starts out by creating problems and conflicts, but always comes up with a way to remedy the situation, and most of the time tried to make amends. (Which is a lot more than can be said about certain other gods...)
He's a trickster god, that's kind of what he does. He usually did real damage by revealing secrets that the other gods refused to own up to.
As far as infidelity goes, in Norse legends pretty much all the male gods cheated; I don't think Loki needs to be singled out.
Later on he did do things out of spite, like the way he cut off Sif's hair, but I think by this point he had come to hate the other gods a little bit, because he wasn't always the bad guy and playing for two sides can be pretty exhausting (since he's an ally to both the giants and the gods, and the two sides fight a lot). Pretty much everything he did for the sake of gods, went unappreciated and/or unnoticed by the same gods. Also, Loki is supposed to be the prettiest and seeing Sif with magnificent, beautiful hair? He can't have that.
When he finally became "the villain" of the story by maliciously killing Balder, even then his moral ambiguity comes into question. It's not that he wanted to be the villain, but according to the Ragnarök phrophecy he was gonna get punished by the other gods regardless, so migth as well go out with a bang. (Btw, giving a huge 'fuck you' to your enemies is one of the most important customs the gods had. So in a way, Loki gave his former allies a huge, double 'fuck you'.)
Because according to the laws of the universe in Norse legends, one's destiny was absolute and there was no changing it; will or actions didn't matter. So, Loki acted like a real dick for once by killing the most beloved god ever, and then refused to bring him back to life. Idk about you, but killing a god (who's lived for years) is pretty tame in my books.

And I think you've got the story about Sleipnir wrong, if you think that it makes Loki an asshole.
When Valhalla was to be build, the gods needed a builder. He was given a deadline, and if the builder didn't manage to finish by that time, he wasn't gonna get paid. Basically, the gods just wanted stuff for free.
The gods thought the builder was a mere human with a normal horse to help with his labor. Turns out the dude was a giant and his horse had super strength, so he almost completed everything ahead of the deadline.
So the gods got angry and told Loki to get the horse away from the builder, or they were gonna kill Loki.
Why Loki? Because he gets shit done. He's also a shapeshifter and he's known for being quite the charmer.
So fearing for his life, he transforms into a horse and seduces Svaðilfari (the strong horse). This is where the legends differ, but in most versions Loki tries to outrun Svaðilfari but fails, gets raped by said horse and gets pregnant from it.
Let's go through that again; Loki gets pregnant by horse-rape, and none of this would have happened if the other gods hadn't been penny-pinching misers with huge egos. It gets trickier when Odin goes "ooh, shiny, GIMME". Now, Loki likes to fuck many things, but I doubt he likes rape, and I can hardly blame someone for not wanting to raise a baby born out of rape.

What I found problematic with the secret was that OP didn't call out Odin (pillage, murder, rape, cheat, lie) or Thor (warmonger, pillage, murder, cheat, lie), one of whom I find really repulsive in the original myths, and it doesn't make sense to me because they're kinda on a different level than Loki when it comes to being a dick.

TL;DR Everyone's a dick in the Norse legends.
I stand by my original point that Loki was symphathetic compared to the other gods. No, he's not exactly nice (unless you count that one time he saved a human family just because he felt sorry for them and the other gods couldn't be bothered), but I still find him pretty symphathetic.

HI CTHULHU ♥

I'm a big fan of your tentacles

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #2000 ]

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long text is long, sorry

Re: long text is long, sorry

Re: long text is long, sorry