fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2003 ]

[ SECRET POST #2003 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2003 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 040 secrets from Secret Submission Post #286.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

DA

oh so we're going with the tone argument, ok!

Maybe don't join big-people arguments if you can't handle some emotion coming into an emotional topic.

We're just so bummed you don't 'respect' us.

There's no need to get like this.

Don't dismiss what someone is saying because you don't like their tone. You aren't the frickin' recess police. We have a right to express ourselves however we want and still be heard. Especially when other people start by talking shit about us.

I will listen to their arguments, of course. What I'm trying to say is that I find it difficult to be open to what they say when they insist on insulting me, cursing me or being so condescending. If they have the right to express however they want, then surely I have the right not to stand for insults.

I think you should keep in mind that in this case specifically you're speaking about a minority whose behaviors have been policed for probably most his life. You have the right to get out of any conversation but not to say that someone doesn't have a valid point because they weren't nice about it. You "finding it hard" to listen is your problem not ours. Nothing in your comment addressed the anon's point. You decided to judge what was and was not necessary, attacking something completely irrelevant to what someone was trying to express and therefore dismissed the original point. I personally feel like you were the one being condescending here. Just because someone uses language that you find distasteful doesn't mean you get to ignore them until they meet your "standards".

Edited 2012-06-28 04:27 (UTC)

+128092445

You fucking preach it!

I said nothing about the original anon's message because I agreed with him. It was the "fuck you" and then the response by the next person about "no offense" but that I was talking about, because those things in general are hard not to see them and make you defensive automatically. Getting everyone angry will accomplish nothing, just making more people angry.

And I never said that they don't have valid points nor do they deserve being heard. I'm just pointing out that they seriously diminish the amount of people who will listen when they use that sort of language. Whether they wish to continue or not is their choice.

Fine, I'll never, ever again try to point out things like that, since apparently this kind of thing is taken more seriously and personally than I expected.

You're usually very nice in your comments (you've even responded in a very polite and cordial manner to me, in other occasions; you're one of my favorite commenters here), which makes me it all the more surreal to see you responding to me like this when I wasn't even trying to be confrontational, or erasing, or whatever else I came across like.

Maybe I was a little defensive but I've seen this attitude and had it directed at me in a very negative way a lot. I'm sorry you were hurt by it. But the people who aren't willing to listen based on language choice don't tend to be the people who would be willing to listen anyway. This felt like the kind of nit-picking that is almost always used as derailment. I've never seen an instance where someone who took issue with superficial word choice actually listened or respected others opinions. If that's not the case here I apologize and hope maybe you can see where I was coming from.

I don't think this is what you meant but, "Getting everyone angry will accomplish nothing, just making more people angry." is difficult to hear because the person who posted the secret got the original anonymous replier angry and it sounds as if you are saying they are not entitled to their feelings or that while the original poster was allowed to vent and act hatefully on their feelings the replier, who feels victimized, isn't and should behave.

Edited 2012-06-28 05:22 (UTC)

I'm sorry too. I probably should have brought it up in the general thread instead, to make it clearer that I meant language in the general sense, not in this specific case. I didn't mean to bring up bad memories, and I think I've seen occurrences of what you mention; but I just dismissed those persons as either trolls or very stubborn people because they often started flinging insults in the same breath, which showed what exactly they were trying to accomplish.

I much, much prefer not cursing irl and online, because I've seen how, unless it's a very friendly environment, it tends to escalate arguments, instead of diffusing them and helping both parties reach an understanding. That's what I was trying to get at in my other comments.

I really should have also mentioned that, if someone has the intention to hurt, or to erase the other person's argument, then a compromise probably wouldn't be reached anyway, but any on-lookers are more likely to listen more attentively to the person that remains calm.

And I'm really not saying that people don't have the right to get angry and curse when they're being attacked, of course not! I'm very, very sorry that I came across like that. That was never what I meant. I really only wanted to point out how remaining calm and polite has more far-reaching success, but of course that we're all only human and cannot be unfailingly polite and unmovable all the time.

This comment got very long. In any case, I hope I'm not sticking my foot in my mouth anymore.

I do think I'll just stop commenting in this kinds of threads like I said before — they're too volatile and I don't tend to word myself well.

I really only wanted to point out how remaining calm and polite has more far-reaching success, I completely agree with this point but it's really only a personal choice you can make. There's not really a good way to tell someone to calm down without making them feel like they are not being heard. Speaking specifically of this situation I've never heard that sentiment turned on the bigot, it seems it is always the minority who is burdened with being civil and respectful without being allowed to expect the same. I don't think that's what you meant to say here and I probably should have done a little more asking and a little less accusing.

I'm sorry this escalated the way it did and hope there are no hard feelings.

I don't know this for sure, but I think the bigots don't get that treatment because the horribleness in their comments is more distracting. Also, I suspect that if you told them to calm down they'd just turn up the trolling and/or the aggression.

...Come to think of it, I'd better let people duke it out and stay out of it altogether from now on.

None at all! This taught me to be more careful with my words, at least. Thank you for listening to me. Clearing this up made me feel much better. Sorry for causing it all in the first place.

I was talking more about RL situations which is why I may have lost it. I've been treated as the problem and people have tried to humiliate me down for responding negatively or defending someone else when people spew vile hatred. A lot of times I'm told to ignore it but you can only ignore so much and a lot of the time not saying something is what allows these people to continue their behavior and feel like people agree with them.

I'm glad you feel better, that makes me feel better!

Edited 2012-06-28 06:18 (UTC)

Oh, I was talking more about internet situations. I'm so sorry you've experienced that. That is entirely different. In real life you can't just avoid a username or hide behind anonymity to avoid reprisals.

TBH it's nice to know there's one less person who actually acts like that than I thought earlier. :)

I really don't think that this person is responding to you in a way that is unfair at all. They weren't swearing, they weren't insulting you - they were responding to you with the exact same amount of politeness that you feel like you were responding to the other anon with.

Yeah, I was reading into it something that wasn't there. Sorry.

but not to say that someone doesn't have a valid point because they weren't nice about it.

yeah except no one said that.

omg you just brought up tone argument

you know how much bullshit that is? NO ONE HERE IS TRYING TO INVALIDATE ANYONE'S POINT BY BRINGING UP THEIR TONE. They're just pointing out that it sometimes makes people difficult to talk to. Which is legit.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #2003 ]

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