Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2012-07-01 03:19 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2012-07-01 03:19 pm
[ SECRET POST #2007 ]
⌈ Secret Post #2007 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 111 secrets from Secret Submission Post #287.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ], [ 1 - text secret ], [ 1 - empty image ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2012-07-01 09:43 pm (UTC)(link)It's always sad when people take "equality" to mean "drag everyone down to the same lower level" instead of "raise everyone up to the higher one." We don't get (something), so you should take it away from the other group! How does that even help /sigh
no subject
(Anonymous) 2012-07-01 10:03 pm (UTC)(link)Well I'd say that in some respects the only way to make people equal is to take away from the group in power. For example, the only way to lower the disparity between rich and poor is to take away from the rich - not to make them poor, but to make them less rich and spread the wealth around to those who are poor.
Or, when it comes to less material things - in using an analogy -
In order for those who are oppressed or less privileged to be heard, those who are in power and privileged must stop being allowed to have the floor all the time. They have to be silent sometimes. Sure, that's taking away from them and in a sense lowering them to the level of those who have had to endure in silence and listen all the time, but it's the only way for those who have been suffering in silence to be able to speak up and be heard. And if sometimes (or, perhaps more honestly, often) those who have been silent and ignored have to shout to be heard and acknowledged, then I don't think we should have to waste much sympathy on the eardrums of those who have been the only talkers for so long.
God that's a convoluted analogy, but hopefully it kind of makes sense?
no subject
(Anonymous) 2012-07-01 10:10 pm (UTC)(link)Taking money from the rich and making the divide smaller doesn't mean that they're no longer rich; what I mean is people wanting the rich to be as poor as they are out of spite. Which helps nothing, frankly. In the other example, giving the oppressed "equal privilege to be heard" doesn't mean you have to take away anybody else's privilege to be heard and make them completely silent. Only give the oppressed the privilege, too.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2012-07-01 10:27 pm (UTC)(link)I get what you're saying about sometimes people just seem to want to make others suffer out of spite because of what they have suffered themselves - and honestly, I can understand that sentiment, although I don't think it's healthy or moral to actually endeavour to bring about that suffering or devote a great deal of time to fantasizing about it - but I don't think it's a clear dichotomy between "we can all have some!" and "I didn't have any so you shouldn't have any either, fuck you!!!"
If someone has everything, then of course they're going to have to lose some of that in order for others to have some. And a big part of oppression and privilege is that it's defined by havers and have-nots. Getting rid of the category of have-not kind of by default gets rid of the category of havers - because if everyone's a haver it can't be a category anymore, since a category can only be defined by being different from something else. If there's nothing else for it to be different from, it can't be a category. If that makes sense.
There was once a really awesome article I read that explained how the identity of white is built on not being a person of colour, and how in order to destroy racism in some ways the whole identity of whiteness has to be destroyed. I'll see if I can find it and post it later tonight when I have access to my bookmarks.
Obviously, though, that can't really be applied to feminism because there's a lot more to gender identity than privileged group vs oppressed group... although it is a big part of it, I'm sure at least some people would argue... this is always the problem with arguing this kind of stuff, there are so many different trains of thought regarding everything. Ahhh.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2012-07-01 10:18 pm (UTC)(link)And some activists wonder why people want to distance themselves from their cause...