fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2033 ]

[ SECRET POST #2033 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2033 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02.

[Mortal Kombat]

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03.

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04.

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05.

[The Young and the Restless]

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06.

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07.

[Firefly, Joss Whedon; Sherlock BBC, Steven Moffat]

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08. http://i.imgur.com/Je2qV.png
[not really porny but implied underage sexual stuff; photomanip; snape/hermione]

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09.

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10.

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11.

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12.

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[ ----- SPOILERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]

13. [SPOILER WARNING for Pokemon Black/White]

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14. [SPOILER WARNING for Kurau: Phantom Memory]

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[ ----- TRIGGERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]

15. [WARNING for rape]

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16. [WARNING for suicide]

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17. [WARNING for incest]

[Kono Naka ni Hikari, Imouto ga Iru!]

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18. [WARNING for animal death/abuse?]

[Eden Lake]

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #290.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Yes, obviously, human sexuality is fluid

Yes, but the only "fluid sexuality" we've actually seen on the show is a lesbian falling for a man. And before you say, "But John--" Give me one scene, one line of dialogue, ANYTHING that implies that his relationship with Sherlock is any stronger after that scene than before it. Instead it's usual "I'm not gay" bullshit, and him calling Sherlock an annoying dick.

I think my main problem with it that it was not important to the plot (or any subplot) and it was just thrown in to make it more "interesting". there was no reason to purposefully write her as lesbian only to have her fall for a man, except for the sake of a cheap gimmick..

Exactly. If she had been one in canon (yeah, yeah, I know; humor me) and Moffat wanted to play with that, that'd be one thing. But he specifically made her a lesbian, did nothing with that (she didn't have a girlfriend, and yeah, we see her with a female client, but that's her job and she refers to male clients a lot more) then had her fall in love with a man. It's just... pointless and stupid.

there is a fan theory that Hounds takes place DURING Scandal, and looking at it from that perspective (that is, the plot that happens after the scene with Irene would be Reichenbach), John's relationship with Sherlock does seem somewhat different. IMO.

Yeah, I don't really see that. The "annoying dick" comment happens in TRF, as does John getting upset when a paper refers to him as a "confirmed bachelor". And when Sherlock pulls the gun, John's all, "I'm not with him!" which... really? That seems assholish regardless (that bit seems a little OOC to me), but if he supposedly had some big revelation because of his meeting with Irene, you'd think he'd "stand by his man" a little more...

. . .am I the only person on the thread that thought the 'annoying dick' line was rather affectionate? Sherlock IS an annoying dick, and John cares about him and puts up with him anyway.

I never thought about the hostage bit being a bit OOC, but I see where you're coming from. I guess I just assumed that John wanted one of them to be able to explain the whole thing away outside of a jail cell when it was done. . .

Well, in fairness, that was kind of the context (he WAS using it as a way of telling Sherlock he believed in him, after all), but... I dunno, why not have him actually say something nice?

I think saying something nice would have defeated the point. John had two things he wanted to say in that bit there. One was "No, I know you for real." which he does, he's lived with him and worked with him and cared about him for a good while. The second was "No one could fake being such an annoying dick all the time." This proved that he didn't put Sherlock up on some pedestal or have any illusions about him: one of Sherlock's (in the BBC canon version) main character traits is that he's a complete dick. Both Sherlock AND John know this, and John is teasing him about it, both to reassure him and to lighten the mood. Also, John has issues with being openly affectionate with most people, so that adds to it too.

If John had said something along the lines of "No, I know you for real. You have such a big heart. . ." I probably would have started laughing. . .

"No, I know you for real. You have such a big heart. . ."

How about him saying just the first sentence?

Because he wanted to tease him? Idk. I liked it the way it was and found it affectionate enough, but YMMV I guess :D

I guess...

My point is, if they were trying to compare Irene and John's feeling for Sherlock (which is kinda weird, anyway--she'd known him for five minutes, John had known him for almost a year...), why is it that we really only see the evidence of Irene's feelings and not John's?

I don't know. I see John's evidence of John's feelings more in his actions than in his words anyway. I mean, in the scene where they compare Irene and John, he's yelling at her because he's angry because she's made Sherlock depressed and John is worried that Sherlock's a danger to himself & he's been watching over Sherlock like a hawk for days.

I guess MY point is that yeah, sometimes their affection is shown in weird ways (fondly calling Sherlock a dick, poisoning John out of 'trust'), but it's still there (in a fucked up way), even if they don't ever say "oh, I love you so much" etc. etc.

I don't really know how their relationship could be stronger 'after' that conversation than before it, though. The conversation is about Sherlock and John 'already' being a couple. Unless John decides to completely throw his heterosexuality out the window (and Sherlock does. . .whatever he does, his sexuality canonically is ambiguous), they're as close as they're going to get.

. . .I'm kind of amused that I'm on this side of the argument because I don't even ship Sherlock/John

I don't really know how their relationship could be stronger 'after' that conversation than before it, though.

Then what was the point of that scene? It created all these issues for no damn reason.

And this isn't really about shipping (though now that I think about it: If the show is making a comparison between Irene and John, and Irene wants to jump Sherlock bones, shouldn't John want to, as well?). I'm not saying they have to have sex, or even kiss, but... something.

Re: Containing some spoilers...

biohazardgirl - 2012-07-28 07:26 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

fenm - 2012-07-28 08:35 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

htebazytook - 2012-07-28 13:59 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

biohazardgirl - 2012-07-28 19:12 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

biohazardgirl - 2012-07-28 07:33 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

fenm - 2012-07-28 08:35 (UTC) - Expand

I'm a shipper through and through, but looking at the Irene/John warehouse convo w/o the slash googles, she's talking about how John and Sherlock are dependent on one another--I don't think she literally meant a romantic couple

Re: Containing some spoilers...

biohazardgirl - 2012-07-28 19:07 (UTC) - Expand

:::why is it that we really only see the evidence of Irene's feelings and not John's?::::::::

Sorry have you watched this show?

Re: Containing some spoilers...

fenm - 2012-07-28 14:22 (UTC) - Expand

i agree. ignoring sherlock's shitty behavior in that scene would have been really ooc for john. he always calls sherlock out, so why would this be an exception? and the way he says it makes it quite easy for sherlock to understand what john is really trying to say, which is that he trusts sherlock and cares about him despite that fact that he is a massive bastard sometimes.

as for the scene with irene and john, well, i really chalk that up as bad writing, because that whole episode is abysmal. i know they took some of that conversation out of canon, but i don't have any idea why it took place in the show. i see john and sherlock's relationship as developing into something that one day will be very close, but they haven't known each other that long, and to state it so obtusely like that so early on is ridiculous, imo. and irene suddenly being smitten with sherlock after having met him for 5 minutes...just lol. but there are so many other things i could say about that episode, and it's just wasted breath. easier just to say that none of it made any damned sense.

The scene between Irene and John takes place nearly a year after John and Sherlock first met. An they became friends MUCH after int the BBC version. So I'm not sure I'd call it "early on".

Irene suddenly being smitten with sherlock after having met him for 5 minutes

I agree, and I think it works both ways. As you say they met once for five minutes as of that scene, but I'm supposed to buy that Sherlock was so depressed when she "dies"...? Bullshit!

:/ Canonically they were pretty much instantly friends. I'm not quite sure what you're talking about when you say that they weren't friends, unless you're talking about what Sherlock says in "Hounds" when he's paranoid and having a panic attack because he's drugged on fear gas.

They liked each other, and lived together; but Watson didn't start working with Holmes, or finding out things about him, for weeks.

Re: Containing some spoilers...

biohazardgirl - 2012-07-28 20:33 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

fenm - 2012-07-28 20:42 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

biohazardgirl - 2012-07-28 20:47 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Containing some spoilers...

fenm - 2012-07-28 20:57 (UTC) - Expand

oh i know the timeline, it just feels completely out of place to me because there are so few episodes. i didn't get a sense of them having spent a substantial amount of time together. their whole relationship felt rather rushed imo.

Fair enough. Yeah, with only three episodes, you don't get much each season. And I don't know why Moffat felt the need to cram nearly a whole year into one episode; that doesn't really help matters.

:::why not have him actually say something nice?:::::

Because that would be horribly OOC?

It was affectionate--Sherlock smiled at him after!

It never fails to amaze me how completely people can miss the point with John and Sherlock when they claim to ship them

The number of fucking stories where a "lesbian falls for a man".. it's not edgy, it's male wish fulfilment.

Yep. d-:

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