fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2137 ]

[ SECRET POST #2137 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2137 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 015 secrets from Secret Submission Post #305.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ].
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12. http://i.imgur.com/fZLc5.gif

I'm a massive fan and I hated this scene. Second hand embarrassment all over the place.

Same.

I should have been delightedly going OH NO, HE DI-INT, but... there is such a thing as too much of a good thing.

I thought I'd never have to see that damn gif again now tumblr is over that episode. So embarrassing. And I love Starscream. *dies*

What the hell is this?
No seriously, wtf is going on there? I haven't watched TFP since the summer break and thought this gif was one of The Hub's jokes (like the one with Megatron listening to My Little Pony).

PS: Thirding (?) the secondhand embarrassment. And I don't even know what this is about.

It didn't "really" happen, but it was part of an episode. Without being too spoilery, it's seen as part of Starscream's own imagination/unreliable memories. And I think he was embarrassed too.

Didn't really happen? I thought everything that we saw in that ep was supposed to have happened -- Megatron said that the memories could not be altered or modified and literally said "What we see is how it happened."

My assumption was that that meant that SS really had made them chant All Hail Starscream at him and danced. We just didn't see that bit because it was never in the stuff we got to see in episodes.

If that makes any sense.

(Nota bene: I do agree that memories are unreliable. But I think Megatron's "how it happened" bit was supposed to mean that within the ep we were supposed to consider it factual, not imagined or embellished. Even though that's not how real memories work at all.)

Edited 2012-11-08 23:35 (UTC)

I'm the anon from above.
I kind of hate how often Starscream was played for laughs in TFP. Don't get me wrong, Starscream has always been pathetic in many continuities, but it seemed to me that in TFP he was just supposed to be the butt monkey of all Decepticons (heck, even comic relief Knock Out was often more dignified than him).

That's one of the many reasons I stopped watching.

I agree. I'm really pleased with his competence and badassery in the last three episodes. But the buttmonkeying really bothered me too.

As does some of the "Megatron doing crazy shit just because he's so evil"ing.

*facepalm*

MY LOVE/HATE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE TFP 'CONS, LET ME SHOW YOU IT

CURRENT VALUE: LOVE

Edited 2012-11-08 23:48 (UTC)

But Starscream has always been played for laughs and supposed to be the buttmonkey. This is hardly a new thing. If anything, TFP!Starscream is among the more competent versions. I mean, G1 is... G1. TFA could be pretty badass but he was still a loser and consistently played for laughs. I'm still surprised that so many fans see the Prime version as more pathetic than the other versions. What are you comparing him to?

I can't speak for the anon, but for myself -- I had high hopes for him at the beginning. He seemed quite competent, managing the Decepticons' affairs well and avoiding conflict with the 'Bots while harvesting resources. He also killed Cliffjumper (admittedly, not difficult given CJ was already a prisoner.)

To me, this seemed to suggest he would be a competent lieutenant with clever schemes, not a woobie buttmonkey. (They seem to have shifted back toward the former at the very end of S2, but I don't know how long it will last.)

Personally, I find both Starscream and Megatron to be portrayed very unevenly. Just as SS is sometimes a buttmonkey, sometimes a woobie, and sometimes the guy with the amazing plans, Megatron is sometimes a fierce, fearsome, and cunning warlord, and sometimes completely stupid about his ax crazy.

My personal opinion as a Decepticon fangirl who loves both characters is that the competent, clever versions of each are absolutely stunning and among my favorite versions of them ever, but that the poorly-written "evil breaks things all by itself" versions are so bad as to make me want to throw things.

So I have a real love-hate relationship with the 'Cons in TFP. When they're awesome, they make me squee forever, but when they're not, RAGE.

this seemed to suggest he would be a competent lieutenant with clever schemes, not a woobie buttmonkey
He is a competent lieutenant with clever schemes, though. And he's also the buttmonkey - because he brings it upon himself. I don't think this is a contradiction at all. In fact, it's something that he has in common with the G1 and TFA versions. A big part of Starscream's character has always been that he could be really, really badass if he didn't screw over his own plans out of overconfidence, or freaking out, or not knowing when to shut up. I don't think it makes him contradictory, I think it makes him a complex character.

It's the same with Megatron. He's a fearsome, competent warlord who's clearly going crazy.

I understand fandom disliking these protrayals, sure. It's all a matter of taste. But while I think TFP has many flaws, I don't think this is one of them. To be honest it surprises me that when we get characters with more than one side to them, a lot of the fans seem to not want that. I'd find a Starscream without his buttmonkey side incredibly boring. What makes him one of my favorite characters is precisely that he has all that potential but he self-sabotages himself all the time.

(no subject)

stainless - 2012-11-09 00:25 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

laurus_nobilis - 2012-11-09 01:29 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

stainless - 2012-11-09 01:54 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

laurus_nobilis - 2012-11-09 02:11 (UTC) - Expand

G1 Starscream in almost all comics? Armada Starscream?
Also nonny said they were aware of other Starscreams being losers.

For me it's so bad since TFP Megatron is portrayed as brutal, crazy and no-nonsense. A whiny loser Starscream just bounces off diferently on such a Megatron.

In the G1 cartoon and TFA both Megatrons had much more funny banter with their respective Starscreams. It was more light-hearted than TFP.

Also nonny said they were aware of other Starscreams being losers.
I know. That's why I'm confused by this attitude (in fandom in general, not just with anon above). I think it's... naive, for lack of a better word, to expect one of the most popular characters in a mainstream cartoon to resemble the comics versions more than the versions from the previous mainstream cartoons.

I don't think TFP!Starscream is only a whiny loser, but I explain that part better above.

As for the different tone: yes, it's true that TFP is darker. I still don't see how this means Starscream can't get played for laughs at all.

But, well, I suppose this is going to be an "agree to disagree" case because clearly everyone has very strong opinions on this already.

IDW Starscream in All Hail Megatron, too. THAT was an interesting relationship. Megatron actually respected him, without it diminishing their rivalry or making them not seem like themselves.

The "you are the one who fails to see that, Starscream, not me" speech in that still gives me chills.

Personally, why I prefer TFA Starscream is that although he's just as much of a failure, he still remains egotistical, prideful, and does not put up with anyone's crap and just keeps on trucking while sporting that attitude.

TFP Starscream has his moments, but he spends like half of it whimpering and reduced into a pale shadow of himself (specifically his Season One self). This is the same Starscream who viciously murdered Cliffjumper in the first episode, then around Season Two, started whimpering around Silas for no reason other than the plot wanting to make Silas look threatening (even more dubious because the episode before had SS all up in Silas' business).

Though I actually liked Starscream shaking his hips in that episode; it's funny!

Oh, yes, if like TFA best I can see how this one bothers you. Like I said up there about Megatron, I think they're more or less "G1 taken seriously". TFA went in a different direction.

That said, I always got the impression that most of his whining and whimpering was supposed to be fake. Look at his fight with Arcee, for example, where he turned it around at the last moment. I think a big part of it is an act on his part to get away with stuff. Or when Dreadwing is threatening him - he stops to go "oh, you know about that" in his normal voice and then turns it up to eleven again.

ETA: ... and I'm still

laurus_nobilis but didn't realize I was logged into my RP account, heh.

Edited 2012-11-09 13:15 (UTC)

(no subject)

neoyi.livejournal.com - 2012-11-10 05:04 (UTC) - Expand

I sure hope it didn't really happen, because it was ridiculous. I assumed what we saw was simply how Starscream remembered it. True the actual scene back in Darkness Rising cuts off just before, but we later see the drones second-guessing/back-talking him, so a spontaneous show of support when Megatron has just died is unlikely.

Megatron isn't the smartest mech, so I'm going to continue to happily believe he was just wrong XD

I didn't think it was a show of support. I thought it was a "fuck, guess we better humor this damn fool."

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, then. The whole scene was so excruciatingly embarrassing and ridiculous I never thought it could have been intended as "real" /:

I viewed it as one of Starscream's daydreams. There were instances throughout the episode where Scream muttered "I'm thinking out loud again, aren't I?" after scenes like that.

Thanks for explaining! :)

AND IT'S THE PELVIC THRUST
THAT REALLY DRIVES THEM INSA-A-A-A-ANE

CONGARTULATIONSSSSS

YOU WIN THE EVERYTHING

Not a Transformers fan, not a goddamn clue what scene this is even about, and... I'm completely mesmerized by that hip swivel.

Suddenly all those "HOMG STARSCREAM SO SMEXY" secrets from a while back make sense!

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