[ SECRET POST #2356 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2356 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 134 secrets from Secret Submission Post #336.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 2 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

Because most fans come onto fan sites to discuss what makes them feel good, not bad. Is it so hard to move to a separate forum if you want to down-talk it? It is just common politeness. No one is saying you cannot trash talk something, just do it where it won't make people who came to talk about how they enjoyed it feel bad about their fandom. It is no harder than taking trigger material or spoiler material to separate forums to avoid upsetting people.

[(Anonymous)]

And some fans like to do both. Fans who like only positive discussions aren't more legitimate than any other fan, and fans are entitled to post whatever discussions they want. If you disagree with the poster's thoughts, you can say so or just ignore the discussion. That doesn't mean they don't have the right to post it.

And I don't think triggering or spoiler material should be taken to different forums either. They should just be marked so people who want to avoid them can do so.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh, I see, you enjoy being a dick because not being one is too hard?

[(Anonymous)]

Uh, no, discussing problematic part of shows does not equal being a dick.

[(Anonymous)]

Discussing it with like minds is fine, preaching at other people who are just trying to enjoy their fandom is being a dick.

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, preaching is being a dick. Starting discussions in general fandom communities is not. Those are not necessarily the same thing.

[(Anonymous)]

They are if you are down talking something. Talk about how you enjoyed it in the main forums, and go to a "problematic" specific forum if you want to down talk it. Otherwise you are making people who wanted to be happy and enjoy it miserable. Making people miserable because you want to share your issue is being a dick.

[(Anonymous)]

Unless the community is called something like "fandom_squee" or the rules specify only positive discussions, it is a general community for discussing both positive and negative parts of a fandom. If people only want to talk about positive things, they are the ones who need to make a community specifically for that. A general fandom community is not restricted to only positive discussions unless it says so.

[(Anonymous)]

Talking about how you enjoyed it is the default. If there is negative commenting then it is what needs labelled separately. Unless it is "Fandom-comm-name negative views allowed" then keep them out and don't bully people and preach at them for daring to like something and not see your major malfunction.

Is it so hard to be polite and not do that?

[(Anonymous)]

No, actually, the default is talking about that specific fandom, period. If it is a general fandom com, the default is discussing that fandom. Talking about other fandoms is off topic, but discussing things you don't like about that fandom is not.

And why do you keep bringing up bullying and preaching? Those aren't okay, but not all negative discussions are bullying or preaching.

[(Anonymous)]

So, what are your feelings about negative commenting that's unrelated to any sort of social issues- for example, what if someone thinks such-and-such an episode was lousy and wants to talk about why they found it disappointing? Should they be prevented from voicing their opinion in whatever venues their fandom uses for discussing their latest episodes?

[(Anonymous)]

The argument you're making here sounds a lot like the one made by certain people who don't like seeing incest or underage pairings in a general fic comm. According to them, if you don't want to experience the fandom the "normal" way, then it's up to you to create a separate forum in which you can indulge your abnormality--even if the general comm's rules don't say anything about forbidding certain pairings--because posting incest or underage fic to the general comm makes "normal" fans miserable. Which, hey, might be another thing you believe! But, if so, you'd be wrong about that, just as you're wrong about what's acceptable to post on a general (i.e. not squee-only) discussion comm.

[(Anonymous)]

...

Which side of this argument are you supporting? You seem to be equating social justice discussion with incest/underage pairings.

[(Anonymous)]

Don't know about them, but you clearly do.

[(Anonymous)]

Like how if women are bothered by rape jokes, they should hang around places where men might make them. Men like to make rape jokes, if women don't like it when rape jokes are told then they can just ignore them.

[(Anonymous)]

I can't tell if you are being serious. Are you really comparing the existence of rape jokes to discussions of problematic content in general fandom forums?

[(Anonymous)]

Same principle at play.

[(Anonymous)]

Except that rape jokes are not okay and there is nothing wrong with starting discussions?

Let me just say, I do have a problem with the people who insist their interpretation of what is wrong with a fandom is the only way to look at things or that everyone has to talk about the problematic things in a fandom. That is not necessarily the same thing as just wanting to talk about those things, though. In a general fandom community, any discussion is game.

[(Anonymous)]

Bullying people for liking what you don't like is not okay either.

[(Anonymous)]

No one was talking about bullying except for you. I agree that bullying people is wrong (though not on the level of rape jokes). Discussing what they don't like about something is not bullying, though, unless they insist that everyone has to agree. Which is not what I was talking about.

[(Anonymous)]

Glad you agree bullying people is wrong, so you'll agree that trying to make people miserable because you didn't like something is not acceptable.

[(Anonymous)]

All men like to make rape jokes and there is no chance a woman would find it funny.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm a woman and I find some rape jokes hysterical. /shrug

[harp]

Like how if women are bothered by rape jokes, they should hang around places where men might make them. Men like to make rape jokes, if women don't like it when rape jokes are told then they can just ignore them.

We can cut through a lot of the nastiness here if we quit it with the group divisions for two seconds. Check it out- "Like how if someone is bothered by violent jokes..."

We're not going to move forward if we don't quit scattering all of these "you people" seeds.

[otakugal15]

This. I've run into that problem on tumblr in one of main fandoms at the moment. If I discuss or point out major problematic elements about this one character that your character is expected to LOVE, I'm "polluting the tag with hate."

I get mean about the character sometimes, sure, but I mostly write about how these interactions tend to contradict what he says in others. Otherwise, I'm very positive about the game and the stories, despite problems. but people are pissy that I'm not loving their little woobie, who tends be downright sexist most of the time.

Then again, I'm one of those people who believes that if you're talking about a fandom, character, what have you, you tag it as such. even if it's "hate."

The whole "don't tag your hate," for me, only applies to people who literally hate a character by being racist, homophobic, sexist, what you in their reasoning. Valid points do not, to me, equal hate and therefore have as much right to be tagged as the positive stuff. and if they get tired of seeing it, either ignore me or scroll on past.