[ SECRET POST #2562 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2562 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 044 secrets from Secret Submission Post #366.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[greenvelvetcake]

I hated them together in the movies because the awful Kili-gets-shot-and-Tauriel-has-to-go-all-glowy thing dragged on far too long and took away from the major plot... but the relationship the fandom has concocted is 1000% better than anything we got in the movie.

[(Anonymous)]

... Am I the only one who remembers Arwen and Rivendell being all glowy from Frodo's perspective in Fellowship while he was poisoned? I thought it was kind of a nod to that because they keep throwing in so many other references to the LOTR trilogy. :|

[greenvelvetcake]

No, most people remember that. I thought it was cheesy when they did it in Fellowship, but it fit in more with the tone of the movie then. When they did it again in the Hobbit, it just ate up time, looked even sillier, and clashed with what we knew of Tauriel up to that point. She was a captain and a fighter, not a healer.

[ellethill]

I'm likely remembering more instances of fanon than canon on this topic, but one canon thing I do know for sure is that Elrond's also a healer (is it fanon or canon that he's considered a great one?) while also being a fighter, so would healing and fighting actually be separate tasks for elves in Middle-Earth?

[greenvelvetcake]

I think Elrond is one of the great healers of Middle-Earth, but don't quote me on that. I can see fighting/healing being important for noble elves like Elrond, but Tauriel is one of the "lowly" elves. Would they bother teaching foot soldiers the super special glowing healing arts?

I also got the impression the Mirkwood elves didn't spent a lot of time learning healing, focusing instead on partying and keeping the spiders away from their turf.

[ellethill]

Likely true on both counts.

I guess I was influenced a bit by my own headcanon here, since for some reason I've always assumed that basic elf healing called on whatever strength/grace/thing the Gift of the Eldar gave them (thereby looking glowy) - and that at a very basic level, the average elf would be able to do some healing, whereas some elves would be particularly gifted (like Elrond). That, and the fact that, now that I think about it, I like this trope better than the typical separation of fighting and healing skills.

[(Anonymous)]

I can see fighting/healing being important for noble elves like Elrond, but Tauriel is one of the "lowly" elves. Would they bother teaching foot soldiers the super special glowing healing arts?

Well, in The Silmarillion, there were two characters written as great warriors who were also capable of (at least some) healing ability. They were Beleg and Mablung, Marchwardens of Doriath (high-ranking border guards, basically), decidedly non-noble and actually held somewhat similar rank to Tauriel, since she's supposed to be Thranduil's captain of the guard. So it is not inconceivable that Elven soldiers of lower social status could have healing skills.

Now the really fanon thing here with Tauriel is that she's a woman, and therefore unlikely to be a captain of the guard in the first place. Tolkien seemed to think that the chief domain of Elven women was to be non-fighting healers, though he did also write that they could fight fiercely when the need arose. See what I wrote about that in the reply below. Anyway, I think we already have to accept that Tauriel is special in this regard, being a warrior by profession, so once that is in place there's nothing to stop her from having healing skills as well.

Also, we don't know enough about Elven healing in canon to say for sure whether it was all glowing and magical or not (honestly, I think this is an invention of PJ's). The best source I can think of is the scene in RotK where Aragorn (raised by Elves) healed Eowyn, and it mostly involved him speaking to her. See it here: http://www.henneth-annun.net/resources/events_view.cfm?EVID=1449

[(Anonymous)]

One could see what Tauriel did as the Elven equivalent of basic field medicine. When she gets the herbs, she has to think about it for a sec, like she's trying to remember something she was taught long ago but hasn't ever had to use. Tauriel could have some basic healing abilities by virtue of being an elf and having been taught some first aid, but would still rank well below the abilities of a true elven healer. That means Kili's injury might not be as serious as the movie makes it out to be, but we could be looking at something equivalent to the the difference between whether or not you have antibiotics. There were injuries and illnesses people used to die of all the time that are considered incredibly minor now because they are so easily remedied (unless you are living in an over-taxed refugee camp or something). Kili would have died without Tauriel's help, but for elves what she did might have been the equivalent of slapping on a band-aid.

[(Anonymous)]

What confused me about that scene: If that was an elves-only kind of healing, how did the dwarf (was it Bofur? I can't remember the names) already know which plant to get? Apparently, they already knew that they needed this articular herb (Athelas (?), I think, to counter the poison) and all Tauriel seemed to do was grab it and steal the show. That's probably not what it was supposed to look like, but it definitely how the writing/the cut made it seem.

[(Anonymous)]

It's canon, although this greatness could conceivably be attributed to the fact that Elrond held one of the Elven rings of power.

In Laws and Customs Among the Eldar, Tolkien did write something to the effect that fighting would diminish one's healing capability and vice versa because "the dealing of death, even when lawful or under necessity, diminished the power of healing". Buuuut he also wrote this fairly late in life and it totally contradicts the existence of several Elven warriors who displayed at least limited healing ability (Glorfindel in FotR comes to mind, ditto Beleg in Silmarillion), so I choose to disregard it.

[(Anonymous)]

those who are close to death see the glow of the souls of elves. that's why frodo saw arwen glowing. that's why kili saw tauriel glowing, has nothing to do with healing.

[greenvelvetcake]

Source? Reason for the glowing nonwithstanding, it's still really silly.

[(Anonymous)]

tolkien.

i think it's silly to discuss whether she should be able to glow or not because she's a knife-ear, she's gonna glow if you're one foot in the grave. doesn't matter how much of a mudblood she is. doesn't take away from the scene being annoying that it's canon.

personally i'd rather discuss the fucking useless battle against smaug they threw in just because they couldn't handle their precious dwarves being depicted as the fucking cowards that they were. that got on my tits in a huge way. but i digress.

[greenvelvetcake]

I'll give the Kili/Tauriel subplot the benefit in that it might eventually go somewhere. They spent 30 something minutes running around to cover Smaug with liquid gold and then he just shakes it off in two seconds! It did nothing but kill time and delay the actual conclusion to the dragon plot.

[(Anonymous)]

I really thought that was so silly. When they started with the water, I was thinking "Hey, good direction you're going there, keep it up!". And then they... went to pour liquid gold on him. Seriously? You're trying to kill a fire breathing dragon with something hot? How stupid can you be?

[(Anonymous)]

sa

aaaaabsolutely agree. gf they wanted the dwarves to desperately do something, why not make them responsible for the chip in smaugs scales somehow? at least it wouldn't have been so phenomenally pointless then. i mean that was the most baffling part i guess, that 30 minutes of movie didn't change ANYTHING. why would anyone do that.

[(Anonymous)]

and don't get me started on the magical black arrows that we only made a few of because really, how many could you need against a dragon? like, 5 or something, right?

that's what happens when you start bullshitting your plot just for the rule of cool.