fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2579 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2579 ⌋

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15. [SPOILERS for Shingeki No Kyojin / Attack On Titan]

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16. [SPOILERS for A Series of Unfortunate Events]

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17. [WARNING for child sexual abuse]

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[The Venture Bros.]

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Sort of a side point, but you can be a woman, not hate women, and pro-life. I'm pro-choice, but I know pro-lifers who really do see it as murder, not as the government getting to decide what they do with their bodies. I don't see it as murder, personally, and I DO think a lot of politicians just want to decide what I get to do with my body. But... pro-life doesn't have to be about hating women. Necessarily.

However, in this case, I really can't see any logical reason other than political motivations to keep the woman alive. Assuming the fetus made it to term, it wouldn't have survived.

I think part of the problem is that people see extraordinary cases presented on (for example) the Learning Channel of a baby born without a brain or with some other terrible deformity that somehow survived for several months, they hear the mother talk about what a blessing the child was and how she'd make the same choice again in a heartbeat, and they conclude that every fetus must be given the same chance, no matter how bad the odds are or how inevitable the final outcome. It's not the easiest argument in the world to refute to any effect, given that it's based more on emotion than logic.

I'm pro-choice, and so are my parents, but then they sent me to Catholic school where I was taught the pro-life position, and it really fucked my morals over because I was young and had been taught one thing by my parents, but then my teachers had all these very convincing reasons for why abortion was murder. They are still convincing, and I have no doubt that most pro-lifers honestly believe abortion is exactly the same as killing a baby, and I don't blame them. "This is murder" is, shock, a tough moral stance to unlearn.

I'm pro-choice, and so are my parents, but then they sent me to Catholic school

Why?

One parent was a Catholic who happened to be fairly liberal and pro-choice, but still wanted me to have the basic Catholic education. It was also close by and cheapo for a private school, and the district public school was shit.

I think the only way a person can really be "pro-life" without being anti-woman is by not thinking through the implications of their position. Because it's all very well to say that an unborn baby deserves a chance to live, and stop your thought process there... but the reality doesn't stop there. Saying that a fetus deserves a chance to live in spite of the unwillingness of the woman whose body it's occupying to remain pregnant places the rights of the fetus above the rights of the woman, and effectively negates a woman's ownership of her own body, making it acceptable to turn her into an unwilling incubator for someone else's sake. That's pretty anti-woman.

If a pro-life person doesn't think about their position beyond "but babies!" then they may not hate women, but they also don't have a very well-thought-out position.

Or they may understand that being a forced incubator is a horrible thing to put a human being through, but not as horrible as murder. The same way a pro-choicer can believe that abortion is horrible (and maybe even murder), but not as horrible as forcing someone to be an incubator.

That's the thing, though: conceptualizing abortion as "murder" necessarily implies that a woman does not have a right to refuse to be an unwilling incubator. Otherwise, even if one did think that killing a fetus carried the same moral weight as killing a born human, it would be considered self-defense, rather than murder.

Wouldn't it only be considered self-defense if the mother's life was in danger?

Or does self-defense legally apply to other kinds of threats as well?

:|a

True, not to mention you can totally be anti-abortion and also staunchly pro-choice. The two aren't necessarily mutually exclusive and I think a lot of abortion debates over simplify the matter.

Yeah, I think too many people equate pro-choice with pro-abortion. As if everyone who believes abortion should be an option WANTS women to have more abortions.

Jesus.

Sure you can. You love the woman and don't want her to be a killer.

Because depriving a person of the basic bodily autonomy that even corpses get is totally loving.

psst anon that's his trollface

LOL

[ SECRET POST #2579 ]

Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

Re: Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

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Re: Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

Re: Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

Re: Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

Re: Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

Re: Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

Re: Technically you can be pro-life and not hate women...

No, you just fucking cant.

Re: No, you just fucking cant.

Re: No, you just fucking cant.

Re: No, you just fucking cant.

Re: No, you just fucking cant.