fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2636 ]

[ SECRET POST #2636 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2636 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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[Pinocchio]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 086 secrets from Secret Submission Post #377.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
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More precisely it is the peoples who collectively are considered the Stans to whom it is offensive. Stan means "land of" or occasionally (depending on context) "person-of", so Tajikistan -for example- is The Land of the Tajiks. The fandom use therefore denigrates the peoples of central Asia and is therefore leads to a prejudicial and negative use of the term. You cannot co-opt a pre-existing term and use it in a new denigratory context without it being offensive to a set of peoples who it previously defined a neutral context.

I am not an expert on the region, but surely the people of the region are the Uzbeks, the Tajiks, the Kazahks, the Krygyz, and the Turkmens (along with the ethnic minorities in the region and other cultures etc)? In fact it kind of seems that using the term '-stans' as a blanket term for those people is kind of strange already from the start - it comes from the names for their countries, not for their peoples. I have a really hard time believing that the usage of the term stan as an insult for obsessed fans is insulting in any way to an Uzbek or a Kazakh.

The usage does depend on context this is true, however yes it can be seen as insulting to members of those peoples (as there is a national-political identity issue attached to it as well as the ethnic one) to use it the way fandom does.

Is "-stan" actually used as an identifier by any of these peoples? Please provide a source for that. Because it seems extraordinarily unlikely for that to be the case or for 'stan' to be regarded as an insult by any substantial group of people, for reasons already outlined.

God this has to be one of the most bizarre arguments I've ever seen on here. Fantastic stuff.

(reply from suspended user)

Stan is a fucking name. And yes you can. It is in no way related to whatever the racial term is. This isn't even one of those murky, maybe it is, maybe it isn't. You know EXACTLY where that term comes from (an Eminem video) and you know it means a crazy fan and nothing at all racial.

That is the stupidest thing I have heard. Hell, those people are taking a pre-existing name and turning it into something derogatory. Should all guys named Stan be ostracized for their racism?

No. A person named Stan is using it in a neutral way as their name. However usage which is inherently negative, as in the derogatory term for an obsessed fan ought to be avoid due to it only being able to be used as a negative. The fannish usage, incidentally, is technically just as insulting to people named Stan as it is to peoples from the Stans; although I admit that few people named Stan will give it enough thought to realize that they ought to be offended. We probably could find someone named Stan who is offended by that use, and that in itself ought to be reason enough not to use a word that is a proper name as an insult. It has a disproportionate effect on those individuals and can, in cases where the name-as-insult is adopted in the mainstream, lead to the proper name itself dropping out of usage (consider the name "Fanny" for example and its vanishing after it was adopted in the UK as a colloquialism for a certain part of women's anatomy).

Wow, I thought you were joking with your first comment. There is a completely unrelated context to the origin of the fandom use of "stan" (as they said, Eninem's song "Stan"). If anything, the only pre-existing thing it could be said to denigrate is people in fandom actually named Stanley.

The convergent usage is covered, inbrief, in comments upthread. Your latter point regarding names is also covered upthread.

My position that it admittedly does also serve a shorthand for identifying twats who have no further arguments other than merely disliking another's position on a character stands however.

wow, that is some tumblr level insanity right there. I'm impressed.

Better. I suspect Tumblr's lawyers are not too fond of your usage of their intellectual property as insult, but that is one for the corporate studies folk to fight over.

+1

It's always nice to see from fresh material around here. A+, much better then radfem!anon and others of their ilk. Shine on, you crazy diamond.

Why are you singling out diamonds as praise? Are rubies or emeralds not good enough? That is gem-ist that is! We other precious stones demand equal parity with diamonds, crazy or otherwise.

Emeralds are more valuable than diamonds.

DIAMONDS ARE JUST OVERPRICED AND OVERHARDEN PENCIL LEAD!

LONG LIVE THE EMERALDS!

May they be loved and protected in their fragile green glory.

(One of the reasons emeralds are more valuable is that they are fragile. It is hard these days to find natural emeralds without flaws or really deep colour. If you want strong-coloured, unflawed emeralds for a low-ish price these days you have to get created ones.)

Can you link us to a specific example of the fandom usage actually converging with the socio-geographical usage? They are two separate things and most people can determine which definition is meant from the context it is being used. Unless, perhaps, we're talking about obsessive fans of the work of Timur Bekmambetov...?!

Asked and answered.

No, you haven't. I want a LINK to a site other than fandom secrets where someone other than you has ever brought up a correlation between the two uses. Provide evidence, please.

June 19th 2012 issue of Golos Tajikistana on page 7, third article on the page, by Oleg Khor, had a very coherent argument covering it. Sadly it isn't online, but if you write to the editor then I'm sure they'll send you a copy.

na

Golos Tajikistana, the communist newspaper, really had an article about fandom? That's...unexpected

The Russian Language Communist Newspaper, published every Tuesday. Yes, yes it did. And I dare you to prove otherwise. It was about the economics of the Federation of Planets from Star Trek and its inherent superiority of the Ferengi Capitalist system. That sounds exactly like something a communist newspaper would cover, doesn't it.

da

Well, I officially have no idea what the hell is going on in this thread anymore

Re: Pet peeve about use of the word "stan"

(Anonymous) - 2014-03-23 03:22 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Pet peeve about use of the word "stan"

(Anonymous) - 2014-03-23 03:28 (UTC) - Expand

Look at this fucking central Asia stan. smh.

win.

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