[ SECRET POST #2665 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2665 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 064 secrets from Secret Submission Post #381.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

Well, in a lot of places it's illegal. So there actually is something wrong with smoking it.

That aside, it's dumb to make a whole holiday to the drug. I think you're defensive reply actually speaks a lot about your own issues with it, moreso than the other persons reply.

[(Anonymous)]

it's a bit of good-natured fun. it's stupid but that's hardly the worst thing in the world. and the reason i'm defensive is because this is an attitude that seems to crop up a lot in nerd circles and it just bothers the heck out of me. i don't even smoke weed (i have in the past, but not for a pretty long time), it has basically nothing to do with me, but the attitude is just so illogical and arrogant.

i probably am reading something into anselah's comment, and sorry if that's the case, but it is something that really frustrates me and they did say a whole hell of a lot about certain peoples' hobbies and recreational activities being juvenile and pathetic

also, are you seriously going to argue that something being illegal means that it is wrong solely by that fact?

[(Anonymous)]

i agree that it's not the worst thing in the world and i think it ignorant to just demonize something/a whole group of people

but someone else before you said 'it doesn't make them stupid' when in FACT it does - it's not a secret, pot makes you dumb...it messes up your thought processes and warps your sense of reality and ability to make well-thought out decisions. It's akin to saying someone who is drunk (actively plastered) can make good decisions

those who say they can smoke pot and function like normal are deluding themselves

also, i tend to find that Americans (moreso than other cultures) equate 'illegal' with 'immoral' - no judgment, just an observation which i haven't seen in most other cultures

[(Anonymous)]

NAYRT

Okay, but would you say that someone who drinks is necessarily a stupid person? There's a massive, gaping difference between saying someone is dumber when high and saying someone is a dumb person because of the fact that they smoke. I think it's absolutely ridiculous to say that smoking makes you a dumb or a bad person, just the same way I think it's absolutely ridiculous to say that drinking makes you a dumb or a bad person. Why on earth do people care so damn much about how other people relax?

FWIW, I don't smoke. I just think it's silly to judge people who do. (And this comment is directed at this whole thread, not just you.)

[tabaqui]

Yeah, sorry, no. Pretty much everyone i know works, drives, plays, etc. with some level of marijuana in their system and none of them are dumb, or have messed-up thought processes. If you get stoned as a motherfucker, sure, but *all* of these people basically do two or three hits and then quit for a couple hours, do a couple hits and then nothing for five or six hours....

But they do it every day. So, again - no.

[(Anonymous)]

Duuuuuuuuude, that's so messed up.

[tabaqui]

How is it messed up? They all have jobs, families, homes. They do charitable stuff, they have bbq's and bonfires, they visit family on holidays, they dye Easter eggs and go see Santa with their little ones, they play video games and plant flowers and cut the grass and go shopping for towels.

Exactly how is 'it' or 'they' so messed up?

[ansela_jonla]

So basically the stoner version of a functioning alcoholic? They'd fail a roadside breath/drugs test, but you'd never know it from their behaviour?

[tabaqui]

Except that pot and alcohol affect people very differently (and different people differently), and i've never in my life met a pot 'addict'.

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think daily use of pot necessarily indicates that someone is at the level of an alcoholic.

My personal experience is in, well...daily use of alcohol. There are many weeks where I'll have a few drinks every night. However, I am not an alcoholic, as indicated by the following two points:
a) I have no chemical dependency. I do not experience any adverse symptoms when I do not drink.
b) I don't have any compulsion to drink. If, for some reason, I can't (medication; training for a race/obstacle course; or, hell, just deciding to put the extra cash toward something else), then I don't, and it doesn't feel like a hardship. There are also weeks or months where, for no real reason, drinking just doesn't appeal to me (the recovering alcoholics I've known tend to find this concept particularly astonishing. It's as if I have a super power).

There can definitely be a fine line between abuse and responsible use of a substance, but I don't think that daily use is necessarily it. Also, while it is possible to develop a psychological dependency on pot, it's somewhat rare. I'm probably in more danger than tabaqui's friends.

I can also say that, having known someone in college who I would say absolutely did have a psychological dependency on pot, I don't think her friends fit the bill. He was awful during that period. It wasn't just that he was consumed with smoking; he was quick to anger, incredibly rigid in his thinking, and nearly incapable of empathy. Kicking the habit turned him back into a normal human. It also gave me an appreciation for the difference between "heavy smoker" and "problem smoker."

[(Anonymous)]

you're implying that having kids makes you more moral. stop it.

[(Anonymous)]

??

They mentioned that they have families and don't let their marijuana use get in the way of having a relationship with their kids or families. While the act of having kids isn't moral in itself obviously, I really don't how you're taking offense to using someone interacting and raising their kids positively as an example for moralness/drug use not getting in the way of other responsibilities.

And this is coming from someone who has no plans to have kids.

[tabaqui]

............whahuh?

[ryttu3k]

Yeah, pretty much this (I don't smoke myself and don't like being around people smoking it, but that's because I have asthma and am quite fond of breathing - I have no problem with it in principle).

Carl Sagan regularly smoked pot for decades. Clearly he was just some idiot stoner with no hope in life, right.

[tabaqui]

Yup. The idea that pot = waste of life is so freaking stupid. I don't smoke either - or drink - but i'll pick the stoner over the drunk any freakin' day.

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, I am going to argue that there is something wrong with doing something solely because it is illegal. It is legally wrong. You said there was nothing wrong with smoking pot, I pointed out one aspect in which it is indeed wrong depending on where you live.

[(Anonymous)]

The problem is that "illegal" and "wrong" suggest very different things. Declaring that something is "wrong" implies that it is either morally or factually incorrect. Declaring that something is "illegal" implies only that it is against the law, and law isn't necessarily morally or factually correct.

When it's thought that an action's legality is what makes it "right" or "wrong," then it's much easier for bad laws to be made, and for those bad laws to remain in effect.

[(Anonymous)]

Ugh. Everyone's being an idiot tonight. Perhaps all smoking too much weed?

[(Anonymous)]

Would you be able to, perhaps, respond to the argument?

[diet_poison]

"it's illegal" =/= "it's wrong" seriously that is such a stupid and arguably damaging attitude

[(Anonymous)]

...so you don't think there's anything at all wrong with doing something knowingly illegal? Even if you disagree with the law you have to admit that there is wrongdoing in not following it.

[(Anonymous)]

Noobody has to admit any such thing. There is noncomformity, controversy and risk in not following it, certainly, but whether that in itself (independent of what the law in question happens to address, which is a whole different can of worms) equals 'wrongdoing' depends on your moral framework. Authoritarian types tend to believe so, but not everyone is an authoritarian.

[diet_poison]

In and of itself, no. Law =/= morality.

Of course, something can be both wrong and illegal. And doing something illegal can also be wrong because of complications/consequences that can result. But just because something is illegal doesn't make it wrong.

ETA: holy shit, I actually forgot what conversation this was in since it's one of two recent law-related conversations ummmm

yeah sorry for pot smoking I got nothing, there is literally no way to argue that the law is actually protecting human rights or public safety (obviously don't do stupid stuff like drive high but just smoking a joint doesn't automatically imply that). I think the law in and of itself is, in fact, wrong and not doing what laws should do.

You can make a case for it being morally wrong (I'm not sure whether or not I would agree), but here are the two possibilities:

1. it is morally wrong, in which case doing it is already wrong with no influence necessary from the law, or

2. it is not morally wrong, in which case you need to ask yourself, if the government made eating pasta illegal, or owning a dog, or wearing purple shirts, or anything else that pretty much everyone else can agree is not morally wrong, would you stop doing it, and would you actually make the assertion that it's no longer ok and is now automatically wrong only because of the law?