fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2669 ]

[ SECRET POST #2669 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2669 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 017 secrets from Secret Submission Post #381.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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I love reading the Starsky and Hutch zines online that still have the art attached. It feels so... nostalgic, even though the era of zines was well before my time in fandom. (What fic is that image from? It's looks familiar, but I read so many s/h zines recently.)

I don't really like art with fics, though. Most of the time the fic is better than the art. (Except for that one time I started reading a Merlin AU fic because the art was amazing, but the fic just didn't interest me.)

Maybe it was on fanlore? I know that site always shows a LOT of examples of fanart on all their pages for different fandoms.

One of the big tragedies of zine fandom is that a lot of them are cataloged and referenced, but only exist in print form and cannot be found or even summarized on the web, so you are faced with a tantalizing unfulfilled glimpse forever.

Not only are the fics impossible to find, but so are letters from letterzines, the precursors of usenet discussions and review comments. I would really like to be able to read the discussions people had way back then, especially given the shift in values.

Oh wow, letterzines, now I am really going to show my age, lol. I published two letterzines back in the 'day' for two tv shows. It really was a labor of love - waiting weeks for actual Locs (letters of comment) to come in the mail via a real mailman ;) Typing it on an IBM typewriter, reducing it in the darkroom at work, pasting it on regular old typing paper to make a booklet form, adding artwork, editorial, etc., then driving it to a printer (really just a shop with massive copiers) and paying a lot of bucks to produce the print run. Then bringing it home, collating it on the floor, stapling them together, putting them in envelopes, addressing them, paying the postage and mailing them. Whew...at their height, my two letterzines had sub lists totalling about 200 people. So, yeah, I spent a lot of money and the sub prices never really covered it, but it sure was FUN ;-) And I did them for a total of about 8 years! Geez, I was crazy ;-)

That's awesome!

That is SO COOL. We have a legend in our midst! What time period was this?

Hearing wild praise for fics that are nowhere online is such torture. There's this one Starsky & Hutch zine fic called "Mojave Crossing" that I've wanted to read for a long time but probably won't be able to until I get my own place and can buy whatever I want without fear of anyone else seeing it.

I WANT TO READ THAT ONE TOO!

Mojave Crossing is everything you've heard about it, AND MORE.

Man, you're torturing us!

I had that zine years ago! I sold it long ago, unfortunately. I wasn't really into the slash in Starsky and Hutch, but I did read that one and it was oh so angst filled and wonderful for the time ;-)

Mojave Crossing wasn't slash, though. Just really strong friendship and hurt/comfort.

Some fans (thankfully few) even object to the zine cataloging and referencing and are furious that those tantalizing glimpses are being alowed. They also protest anonymized quoting from letterzines or summarizing the topics discussed. Hell, when people started donating their old zines to the various archives 5 years ago, these same small minded fans objected to that as well. They basically want fandom to remain their own private club - and damn those who came in after their Golden Age of Zines.

That's so shitty and unfair. How the fuck would they feel if they were locked out of the history of a fandom for a show they liked? Hell, Starsky & Hutch fandom history isn't just about that specific show -- it was a big part of how fandom as we know it today was created in the first place.

I love the zine authors who put their fics up online early on -- I remember some in S&H and Star Trek fandom did it as early as the '90s.

That's so shitty and unfair.

They still own the copyright on their work.

Says nothing there about it being the authors of the fic objecting.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2014-04-25 06:46 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2014-04-25 07:06 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2014-04-25 06:50 (UTC) - Expand

There's a reason for that, though. Slash fandom has always (until Tumblr) been built around an ethos of No One Outside Us Must Ever Know. Anonymity, deniability, no discussion with outsiders ever. (My favorite example is this: http://fanlore.org/wiki/The_Purple_Pages) I think it's easy to forget how much stronger that impulse used to be back in the Before Times.

It's not about the Golden Age, it's about the violation of an ancient oath of silence. Or at least that's how it feels to them.

Still bullshit, IMO. There's a long time to adjust between the 1970s and the 2000s.

Also, until tumblr? No way. Until the rise of ff.net, established in 1999? Maybe. In some fandoms. By the time LJ was a big deal, slash was totally mainstream in the online discussion/fanfic realm of fandom.

Well, in 2009, the well-known Surveyfail incident happened, and the very first comment on the actual survey post (now down, couldn't find an archived version... anyone?) was "I'm not sure I want anyone from outside knowing what we do." And in eruthros' superb post criticizing the survey (http://eruthros.dreamwidth.org/273840.html), the FIRST point she makes is "They are outsiders to fandom. They are outsiders to fanfiction. They are outsiders to slash."

So... yeah. "No outsiders" was still the rule as of Obama's first term.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2014-04-25 17:57 (UTC) - Expand

LOL. I love the "ancient oath of silence." That perfectly describes the moral outage, the betrayed emotions and the bewilderment when they find/see fans talking about slash - Their Slash! - in all the wrong places. Without their permission! How dare they!!!!!

But my favorite personal quote came from K/S fandom. This is from the K/S Press a letterzine that started around 1996, near the dawn of net fandom. The person wrote this in 1999.

"There has been some recent discussion in The K/S Press about K/S stories on the Internet. Well, due to a recent job change, I was required to purchase a personal computer. I’m not on the net and of course the first thing I did was to go to the Star Trek sites. I was very amazed and shocked to find out how easy it was to locate “slash” and K/S pages on the web. I did not realize how easy it was for anyone, and I mean anyone, to find out about K/S by simply typing in Star Trek on the search page and going to all the sites. And while I admit that it was a benefit to me, since I downloaded many of the stories to my PC, I was more than a bit dismayed that it was on the web so openly. It left a rather bad taste in my mouth...fact that it is now so openly displayed on the web, for anyone to see, will only add fuel to their fire and perhaps threaten our special fandom....I think that if K/S is to survive, it must remain underground...We don’t need any more nails in the coffin. K/S is not for everyone, so it shouldn’t be available to everyone. But it is and I think that is cause for worry."*

Read more: http://fanlore.org/wiki/Fandom_and_the_Underground

I love the part where she un-ironically mentions how she immediately downloaded all the pron while in the same breath saying we need to stop all the online pron from falling in the wrong hands. And how slash needs to be "Kept Away from Everybody: Except Me and My Friends aka the "Right People"

Ahahahaha that quote is the best thing ever. SHAMMMMMMME ON EVERYONE WHO POSTED ALL THIS AWESOME PR0NZ I TOTES JUST DOWNLOADED. SHAAAAMMMMMMMEEE.

Also, extra-hot jalepeno chimichangas are "not for everyone" either, but if only those who had been previously inducted into the Extra Hot Jalepeno Chimichanga Fanclub were allowed to eat them, how would anyone develop a taste for them? The logic of these people makes no sense, which is unsurprising since it's just vague attempts to justify their desire to be part of a speshal sooper sekrit club.

I love the part where she un-ironically mentions how she immediately downloaded all the pron while in the same breath saying we need to stop all the online pron from falling in the wrong hands. And how slash needs to be "Kept Away from Everybody: Except Me and My Friends aka the "Right People"

I think, though, that you're not taking into context the time that this was written in. There was a real fear in fandom circles that you could be subject to legal action. Not so different in some ways from current affairs, except that fanfiction is actually more widely tolerated than before, and there's a lot more discussions about fair use and other possible legal defenses, if it came to that. At the time, though, if the lawyers picked you to come down upon, then it could effectively shut down your wing of fandom.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2014-04-25 22:30 (UTC) - Expand

Curious...where do you get these zines online with attached art? Is there a particular site?

http://www.starskyhutcharchive.com/ has some.

Thanks!

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