[ SECRET POST #2746 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2746 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 024 secrets from Secret Submission Post #392.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

01. http://i.imgur.com/TWwFjqv.png

[fauxkaren]

IA. Being first doesn't really matter to me. I just want more of those kinds of movies to be produced. I love both Lilo & Stitch AND Frozen. Two movies about sisters! I like them both.

[(Anonymous)]

same. and i hate when people try to use one of the movies to bring the other down. they deserve better than that.

[(Anonymous)]

Not to mention, despite both being about sisters, they are incredibly different in terms of the relationship of those sisters. In Lilo & Stitch, it's more a parent/child relationship because of the age difference and the fact that their parents are dead, whereas in Frozen they are more like actual siblings without one having to essentially raise the other. Two completely different dynamics.

[(Anonymous)]

Yep, both are two of my favourite disney movies. My other favourite movie is My Neighbour Totoro for the same reason. The love between two sisters moves strong emotions in me, so good movies all of 'em :)

[morieris]

When I see people point out that "____ was the first!" it's usually in response to "Hey - you think Frozen is the end all be all of sisters/rushed stories/not getting married/bland music but these films exist too, and you've forgotten about them." Not so much a checkbox competition (although I feel Disney thinks that re: people of color but eh)

[(Anonymous)]

I don't know what's so wrong with letting people be excited over Frozen.

[galerian-ash.livejournal.com]

I'm not really into the sort of fandoms that are prone to debating that sorta stuff, but... If you're seriously gonna argue about what was "first", you're gonna have to go a long way back in time!

[diet_poison]

ia. there pretty much aren't any original stories anymore - it's all re-hashing. (that doesn't make it bad, of course.)

[kaijinscendre]

I get your first point. That it is annoying people only think about the FIRST in some category or another (though this is generally because they open up the possibility of more).

I don't get what you mean by the small print? I mean, people get mad about movies only focusing on men all the time. And how does the small text relate to the rest of the secret?

[(Anonymous)]

About the second part, I think the issue is that movies with male protagonist don't have to be "first" about anything in order to be appreciated.

OP

[(Anonymous)]

As the other person said, it was that I might be wrong but I don't hear too much about HTTYD being The First Movie By Dreamworks Featuring A Viking Riding A Dragon, but there was an article that flat out referred to an upcoming movie as The First Pixar Movie That Features A Female Lead Who Is A Tomboy And Also Not A Princess.

Movies staring men tend to get discussed on their own merits, movies staring ladies get picked apart for what sets them apart and makes them unique and not like all the other girls.

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, this x1000. Who cares if it's first? There should just be MORE.

[a_potato]

Maaaan I totally get you. Fuck "firsts." I just wanna know about good characters.

[(Anonymous)]

Wouldn't calling a movie the "first to do X" imply we're expecting more like it to follow?

[kallanda_lee]

YEP, pretty much. And if you really care about certain representations, it's not just about being the first, but about having it repeated enough so it's no longer exceptional.

[intrigueing]

I agree so much. It just smacks of people being really insecure about their fandoms and fandom preferences, like they need to have some kind of neutral outside validation for why they like it, rather than their own feelings about it. I see this kind of thing a lot in fandom, with things like this.

Also, stuff like glorifying their favorite episodes (because if they have any flaws, they're worthless). Claiming that every single sentence written by a writer they hate is pure crap (because if he ever wrote a single good thing, all their criticisms are invalid). Denigrating characters so that their favorite will look better my comparison (because they don't believe the character will stand on his/her own). Bashing characters and ships who get in the way of their OTP (because the OTP's love is so fragile that all other options must be absolutely horrific). Insisting that it isn't logically possible for those two male characters to be just friends (because they need gayness to be the only possible option in order to interpret them as gay).

It's probably a sign of low self-esteem.

[(Anonymous)]

<3

[(Anonymous)]

Wow. this is a really great comment.

[nightscale]

So many of those complaints are setting the bar way too high as well, like this movie about women/PoC needs to tick every box on this stupidly complicated checklist otherwise it was complete crap, how about just appreciating the fact that it was a moving focusing on women/PoC instead? Because that's a good thing(and yes I'd like 'good'(never-mind that what constitutes as good is fucking subjective as hell) films with women/PoC too but you're gonna get duds mixed in with the good stuff just like with all the white-dude movies, it's how it works).

[(Anonymous)]

I feel this secret so much. I didn't like Frozen, and a lot of things people claim it was the first to do are untrue, but that doesn't mean they're not admirable still!

I also understand why people are so hyper-critical about female-led movies, but it does get tiring how people pick apart every single aspect of them while male-led movies get none of that criticism. It creates this self-fulfilling prophecy where people walk on eggshells when it comes to featuring women in movies BECAUSE audiences analyze every little thing for problematic messages and so on, which causes fewer movies to be made, which makes people care MORE about the kind of representation, etc.

[diet_poison]

yep, I can definitely get behind this, OP. it starts to feel a bit too much like tokenism, doesn't it?

[miku_hatsune]

exactly! it's really annoying. there's no quota for things like sister films, or POC led fairy tales etc

[cbrachyrhynchos]

Ok, two "firsts" from 2013 which are probably not what you think:

1. First animated film with a female director to crack the yearly top-ten and set animation box office records.

2. First film with a solo female lead to take the annual #1 domestic box-office slot in 40 years, although that's a bit open to interpretation. 45 years if you see Exorcist as an ensemble piece and go with Funny Girl, 16 years if you focus on Rose's role in Titanic.

Both are more likely to be more important in future film development than plot details of Frozen.

[(Anonymous)]

O/T, but I have to admit the phrase "African-American princess" (or ANY "-American princess" puzzles the hell out of me, when it's apparently implying actual princesses.