[ SECRET POST #2967 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2967 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 034 secrets from Secret Submission Post #424.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets (also too big anyway) ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[siofrabunnies]

Hey fellow kinkster! I pretty much agree with you here. It's a ravishment fantasy with bdsm wrapping paper. Of course it's not a healthy romance, but that's probably the point. It's a romance novel. How many romance novels depict a healthy relationship?

Mind, I've not read it, and I don't care one whit to, but it's just porn.

You notice how Twilight didn't lead to the destruction of the teenage girl? Yeah, this isn't going to 'ruin' bdsm. Anyone who would have found Edward/Cristian Grey attractive already did. Christ, people who say it's "dangerous, because women totes can't tell the difference between reality and fantasy" sound like people who claim Harry Potter is going to lead to witchcraft and/or ruin actual (neo-)paganism.

[kaijinscendre]

People on Tumblr talking about 50 Shades of Grey sound like Jack Thompson talking about video games. Or old people talking about rap music. Or really old people talking about rock music. Or really, really old people talking about comic books.

[cloud_riven]

Jack Thompson. Man I haven't heard about that guy for years since he got disbarred somewhere. What ever happened to him?

[(Anonymous)]

He joined gamergate

[blitzwing]

Saw this on flat and thought you were talking about Rascal Flatts lol.

[philstar22]

And if it was labeled as rape fantasy rather than BDSM, I'd have less of a problem. I have a problem with erotica in general that has rape scenes that the book/author pretends are consensual. Label it what it is.

[siofrabunnies]

Oh, I completely agree with you there. That's also a recurring problem in romance novels, right up there with "it's not rape if she enjoys it".

Hell, I'd be fine with a page at the start saying "This is fantasy only. Here are some abuse hotlines/websites. Etc."

[othellia]

This, although replace "rape" with "emotional/mental abuse."

The thing that annoys me about FSoG is the fact that the BDSM aspect gets brought out over and over again (whether it's abuse/just fantasy), but the scariest things are the parts where he stalks her, yells at her, calls her "fucking stupid", and Anastasia keeps internalizing all of it.

Happily(?) though, a lot of the reviews have been pointing out the disturbing aspects of this vs focusing on the sex. Probably because the movie was such a softcore R.

[(Anonymous)]

but the scariest things are the parts where he stalks her, yells at her, calls her "fucking stupid", and Anastasia keeps internalizing all of it.

and that's the really insiduous way it normalizes the things people are less likely to immediately recognize as abuse.

my dad calls my mother "fucking stupid" every day of her life. it's not out of love, and it's not romantic. it's nothing anyone with a shred of self-respect (which has been whittled away in my mother after years of this behavior) should aspire to or want.

[sarillia]

I have read it and it's a pretty terrible depiction of BDSM. Ana doesn't even like it. Her reaction after trying anything tends to be "well, I survived, I guess that wasn't so bad" because she's only putting up with it because she thinks she can't have him any other way. And then he oh so romantically concedes to making love instead of his twisted kinky fucking. Plus there's this ongoing feeling of Christian Grey and Ana making sure we know that they're not into the really dirty stuff that no sane person would want. For something that supposedly made kink mainstream, it's pretty kink negative.

[siofrabunnies]

Wha-? Why would you write porn where the characters don't even like the sex they have?

Ugh, I'm so glad I never let people talk me into reading this dreck. What little I've seen (listening to the dramatic reading of the original fanfic; I couldn't make it through five chapters.), it's so boring, and then so emotionally abusive. I mean, it's no worse than on some erotica sites, but those aren't published.

I have to ask, is there any actual bdsm? Because all I've heard and the little I've seen, it's just emotional abuse, and then some rather vanilla sex.

[sarillia]

There's some attempt to make it seem like she's enjoying it, some halfhearted exposition about how amazing he is, but most of the time she just seems scared and resigned. I don't know, maybe other people are reading the emphasis backwards from the way I do.

There is actual BDSM. She's tied up and blindfolded and flogged and there's some submission with her kneeling and stuff. But a lot of it feels like things that are sprinkled in occasionally to spice it up rather than the main point of the sex, which is otherwise just like any other sex scene most of the time.

[(Anonymous)]

http://www.cosmopolitan.com/sex-love/a36032/fifty-shades-of-grey-in-one-weekend/?fb_ref=Default
Is a fantastic write up of all the sex in it. NSFW, but in a funny way.

[sarillia]

Haha, thanks!

[diet_poison]

lol that's pretty funny.

[(Anonymous)]

Twilight didn't ruin teenaged girls (wtf?), but it did ruin vampire stories for a while. So, yeah, if bdsm was my thing I think I'd have a legitimate concern that the next decade of mainstream bdsm is going to be full of copycat rapey abuse tarted up as "romance."

[(Anonymous)]

I'm feeling like a broken record at this point, but I really feel I have to keep saying this.

The author of the damn thing doesn't think she wrote a ravishment fantasy. She doesn't even think she wrote erotica. That's part of what's disturbing.

Also, people aren't worried about the book "ruining" BDSM. They're worried about people coming into the scene expecting what's portrayed in the book, and being preyed upon as a result. And you know why they're worried about that? Because there already were people coming into the scene, not knowing what's healthy and what's not, and getting singled out and taken in by people who use BDSM as a veil for their abusive behavior. And their numbers have increased since the book came out! And on top of that, since the book came out, there has been an increase in people engaging in unsafe behavior, to the point that in my area, there has been a rise in emergency services responding to BDSM-gone-wrong.

I'm so fucking sick of people acting like it's not big deal and trotting out the "oh, people can tell the difference between fantasy and reality, duh, stop patronizing people!" Someone who doesn't have a decent baseline in reality can't actually tell the difference. It's not patronizing to acknowledge that; it's just, well, reality! And you know what? Contrary to what people like to tell themselves, media DOES have an influence on us. Ever bought something because you saw an ad for it? Ever believe something that turned out to be false because you saw it on the news? We'll accept that we can be influenced in those ways, but we'll fight tooth-and-nail to delude ourselves into believing that fiction can't and never has any impact on us at all.

[(Anonymous)]

tbh, that's probably marketing

romance sounds loads more marketable than unconsensual bdsm rape fantasy

[gabzillaz]

I'm so fucking sick of people acting like it's not big deal and trotting out the "oh, people can tell the difference between fantasy and reality, duh, stop patronizing people!"

Yeah, remember when the movie Jaws didn't cause mass hysteria that lead to people killing sharks left and right?

Oh wait.

People dismissing the criticism because "it's fiction!!1" are missing the point.

[siofrabunnies]

That is an embarrassingly good counterpoint. I probably am too quick to dismiss problems in the scene, because I just get sick of hearing about it. Now that I think about it when it's not super late at night, my comment looks flippant.

There's a huge difference between bdsm and vampirism, in that most people don't believe vampirism exists, and bdsm does. And abuse in the scene is so quickly dismissed in a "we're not all like that" way, which makes it easier for abusers to get away with it, which is one of the big reasons I avoid the scene. It should be about fun sex, not the constant 'fight/ignore abuse' cycle.

So, thank you. I need a jolt to my priorities, it seems.

[(Anonymous)]

very true