[ SECRET POST #3185 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3185 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 025 secrets from Secret Submission Post #455.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

OT3? ... j/k.

I'm watching a fight brew elsewhere over the TNG episode where Dr. Crusher's parasite boyfriend nearly dies, gets put in Riker, then Riker nearly dies, and it gets a new woman host, and Beverly's all "Nah, tho."

And holy fuck, everybody's all "how dare she not be willing to try a relationship with the woman-host!" Like, yo, it's not trans- or homophobic to be straight and only into cismen, y'all. I'm keeping my yap shut, because banhammer but I wish could upvote harder the two brave souls swimming against the tide.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

This is my hot button episode. She's willing to be with the guy through any number of dudes, but not a woman. Not his actual identity - he becomes the woman. That's the individual that she apparently fell in love with, despite the body he was in. In such a progressive time whether there's all this fight for social justice whereever the Enterprise goes, she can't continue to be in love with someone she loves, because their body changed. I hate this episode. Fuck.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

But she wasn't the individual Beverly fell in love with. When the Trills change hosts, they take on the memories and personalities of the new host, so the new host would no longer be him, but another person that has the memories of her lover.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

It's been a while since I saw this episode, but it's difficult to apply the information about Trill from DS9 to it. DS9 makes it abundantly clear that the symbiont and host both provide attributes to make a whole. And in the TNG ep, it seems that only the symbiont controls everything and the humanoid is just a vessel.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

It's not about love, it's about physical attraction. No matter how progressive society gets, some bodies will only respond to penises and some will only respond to vaginas.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

Applying current standards to the 24th century invalidates all arguments. The point is they're supposed to be that advanced. How often does someone wax poetic about equality and the barbaric ways humans used to do whatever?

I'm reminded of that other episode where Riker was all in favor of that other alien who wanted to identify as a woman, despite their asexual society looking down upon it.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

Dude, you can't will yourself to be attracted physically to what you're not. Like, I'm literally repulsed by penises and physically male bodies, so even if personalities clicked like crazy, I couldn't ever be intimate with whoever was inside it.

You're saying that sexuality is a choice and that's horrible.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

I am so happy to see all the responses in this thread that call out the utter bullshit.

[(Anonymous)]

That's like three people. I mean, it sucked that it came off the way you saw it but would you have kept up with all of that? I wouldn't, regardless of how I'm attracted to them.

But also, you can't turn from straight to gay or bi even if you've fallen in love with someone. Asexual people fall in love all the time, if you need evidence.

[(Anonymous)]

"Asexual people fall in love" is basically arguing FOR the case of being in a relationship with someone despite not being physically attracted to them.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

Wait what.

It's been a looooooong time since I've seen this episode, but I thought it was the entire bodyswapping thing that wigged Beverly out, not just specifically the genderswapping aspect of it. Am I remembering wrong?

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

Not OP

She was freaked out a little at first by the male-male body swap, but she got over it pretty quick, and was expectantly waiting for the new body after Riker's wore out, only to realize that the new body was a woman, and then she called off the whole romance.

[(Anonymous)]

Troi had to egg her on, though.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, she freaked out for a little bit over Riker but got over it enough to mack on him. And then when he got the female host she was super closed off and rejected him/her because she couldn't handle the uncertainty of who Odan would be and how often he'd change hosts and that "humans" just aren't that evolved yet.

So at face value it was "I can't handle all the body swapping" but the subtext was "I can't handle being with a woman" and the blame was placed on "humanity." But still. Beverly is straight.

But apparently even mentioning sex as a biological thing is cissexist, so I'm glad I'm doing my venting over here.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

I think TPTB were just afraid to go there at that point in time. Which, they shouldn't have even hinted at it if they didn't want to. That was the problem with a lot of TNG, they stopped just short of whatever point they were going for.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[cbrachyrhynchos]

Uh, I have more important shit to worry about than an episode that's old enough to drink?

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

And yet here you are, commenting on it.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

So, go worry about that other stuff and leave us alone? It's ok to not comment on threads t5hat don't apply to you.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[cbrachyrhynchos]

1. It's trek, and
2. You're making a big deal about "transphobia/cissexism/homophobia."

Either of which is stomping in my yard.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

Sometimes, you're okay. And then other times, you're a smug jackass.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

yeah see a while back this episode did bother me for that reason but...it was the 80s, man. Even putting the Trill into a female host and having the Trill herself be all "what do you mean we're not going to keep dating?" was progressive for the time. Shockingly progressive. It's not that progressive for our own times, which really shows just how much we've changed as a society in the last 20-25 years.

it bothers me less than the genderless aliens. I'm with Jon Frakes, I think it would have been amazing to have his love interest played by a man. that would have shattered boundaries, but it goes to show that for as many boundaries as TNG tried to push, back in that time period (oh god) there were still things you couldn't get away with on tv, even in a sci-fi context.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

as someone who is trans and is only attracted to cis men, that's bullshit. no one is entitled to attraction, and that tumblr-esque mindset comes dangerously close to hand-waving the concept of consent sometimes.

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

What the fuck. Seriously, what. the. fuck? Isn't everyone aware by now that being bi or homosexual is not a choice?

So why the FUCK is being hetero? Seriously, people! This /should not even be a question!!!/

Wanna talk double standards? That's them, right there.

Man, that view pisses me off!

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

*gay

this isn't the 1980s

Re: Transphobia/Cissexism/Homophobia

[(Anonymous)]

For me it's just annoying that the producers made that decision. Like I don't see the point in being mad at Crusher or sticking a label on her sexuality either way because she's not real, but this was just one of many cases were Trek kiiiinda talked about lgbt issues but not really? But it's also from the 80s. So.