fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #3227 ]

[ SECRET POST #3227 ]

⌈ Secret Post #3227 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.

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02.

[Mary McDonnell, Battlestar Galactica, Major Crimes]

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03.

[Deadly Premonition]

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04.

[The Walking Dead, Glenn Rhee]

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05.

[Bill Skarsgård]

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08. http://i.imgur.com/LAq54d4.jpg
[link for random penis]

Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 01 pages, 018 secrets from Secret Submission Post #461.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

The way non-depressed people talk about suicide infuriates me.

I understand that some people have been forced to shoulder the burden of their loved one's death. I understand that it's hard. I have lost people that I loved to suicide as well. But what I don't understand is this stark, hateful condemnation of people who do it.

They say "this person gave up, this person hated their family, this person was selfish and awful and greedy". Every time I see someone talk about reasons to not commit suicide, it is about other people. It's never about the person who is depressed enough to want to literally die. It's about everyone else. Maybe that works on some people. I don't know. I hope it does help somebody.

The people who rant about the "selfishness" are probably some of the same people who turn away when they witness depression. Why should they help? There are doctors for that! (That don't always help.) There is medication for that! (That doesn't always work!) Why should they expend any effort? They aren't willing to spend five minutes of their life a little uncomfortable, but say that depressed people should have to suffer through agony so that they don't have to lose them?

I'm not saying people should kill themselves. I'm not saying it's a good thing, not at all. But there's so little understanding and so little effort. And so much judgment.

My sister is like that. She rants and says she won't feel bad because they're just selfish assholes. Then turns around and thinks I just need to try harder and get over it. She absolutely one hundred percent does not understand depression. Or social anxiety, but that's a whole other issue.

I feel you. On one hand, knowing that killing myself would destroy my family probs played a big part in not taking that step. On the other hand, saying shit like "suicidal people don't remove pain they just pass it on others" just makes them feel like even more shitty. People saying that don't get how warped the view of the world of a depressed person is. I felt that even if my family suffered they would feel better if I was dead rather than a living disappointment.

Word. The irony? For so many people who are depressed, they genuinely believe they're doing their loved ones a favor by killing themselves because they believe they're such horrible, worthless people that everyone is better off without them.

This is actually true for me. I'm a financial burden on a single parent who's about to retire and I don't know what we're gonna do. He would be better off without me.

Assuming he loves you - no he wouldn't be. Like, even if that were completely objectively true, this doesn't factor in the feelings parents have for their children, and the fact he'd be completely destroyed if he outlived you.

ayrt

Oh, it would upset him. He's dealt with a lot of death, including suicide, all his life. But he would go on, he always has. I don't know what to do. I cannot work because I am all sorts of not hireable (and lucky for me, not eligible for any government aid), and his retirement isn't going to support us both.

Sometimes I dream of disappearing first, so he won't have to know, but I think that would be harder on him.

Death of child is, from what I hear, unlike any other loss. It would more than "upset" him.

Just because he'd be better off financially, doesn't mean he'd be better off as a human being.

He's already lost a child, his parents, a sibling, and his wife. He's really rock solid. I mean, I know he'd be lonely, but... dunno. he'd carry on like always, you know? It just seems like something that would be better than me mooching him into the poor house.

It's funny, I hate my life right now, based on the fact that I hate my life so much I don't know what to do anymore.

The problem with the way you write this in combination with you saying you're not really employable makes my think you have at least some mental and/or physical health issues, right?

There are some mental issues, mainly depression but other too, that b definition cloud our own judgement.

Even if what you say is true and your dad would go on after you're gone...I'm pretty sure that's not what he'd WANT.

But if we're thinking practical solutions of the problem - are there perhaps little was you could contribute to the household?

Obviously I do not know our exact situation, but I'm thinking out-of-the box stuff that doesn't require you to be in an office or whatever...example, selling/reselling stuff on e-bay. I have an ex who made some extra cash by fixing and reselling servers. It's just a example.

Another option is to explore if your condition(s) would be eligible for benefits in another state or another country. If you're desperate anyway, might as well try.

In any case, good luck. And don't kill yourself. I really AM quite sure that isn't what your dad would want.

Re: Trigger warning for suicide (non-explicit)

(Anonymous) - 2015-11-05 02:55 (UTC) - Expand

Re: Trigger warning for suicide (non-explicit)

kallanda_lee - 2015-11-05 08:26 (UTC) - Expand

Or perhaps, having lost all those people, it helps to think that he still has you. I've lost most of my family and when my mom, who has terminal cancer and has been suicidal for much longer than she's had cancer, pulls out the "you'll be better off when I'm dead" thing, I try to tell her that yes, death happens to everyone, and it's sad, and I miss all my family who have died, but their deaths didn't break me. But the one that came closest to doing so was my dad, who might've committed suicide. We were pretty much estranged by the time he died, and he'd done a lot of shitty things, but thinking that he felt so miserable and alone that he chose to die was really, really awful. My benchmark for "will improve the world by their death," whether I know them or not, is, like, "serial rapist murderer child molester who eats a human-baby sandwich with a puppy-ear garnish every day." Otherwise, someone will miss you, and the world will be a shittier place without you in it. Especially for your dad. Please don't try to die.

Re: Trigger warning for suicide (non-explicit)

(Anonymous) - 2015-11-05 03:05 (UTC) - Expand

I always hated that. And they make it really personal so you know if you offer any sort of different viewpoint other than "people who kill themselves are selfish" they're gonna flip out. It's like they put up a wall to protect themselves from the trauma but that wall also separates them from empathy for the person who suicided themselves.

I really agree with you, tbh.

It really rubs me the wrong way. Like you owe it to someone to stay alive for them - and hell, if you're deeply miserable, you should just suck it up and soldier on.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think being deeply miserable is by definition a reason to kill yourself, especially if you have options to explore to make you less miserable.

However the whole "owing life to someone" just makes my skin crawl.

Like you said, it's never about the person.

I recall that, maybe 2 or 3 years ago, I googled "suicide survivor" and was baffled to find it was a term used for relatives/friends of someone who killed themselves, instead of people who survived a suicide attempt (which I was looking for).

So yeah.

Obviously I don't want to minimize the experience of losing someone. I did a documentary once that included a family that lost a son to suicide and it was...well, absolutely dreadful.(Also very weird if you as the interviewer attempted suicide in a similar age range. It's like feeling like some transferred guilt, but I digress).

But I think because of taboo and mental illness we get a lot of healthy people talking about it, and less voices of those who actually experienced it.

What about when they have a kid? In the case I know about first hand a six month old. With a mother who couldn't work. I'm not going to lie, I feel a contempt for that person.

See, the problem there to me is that the birth of a child is a massive uprooting of your life and can mess up your mental health so much (especially for moms, as pre-existing depression is an almost sure indicator of one bitch of post-partum depression. But I understand from you post this was the dad?)

The sad truth is that some people shouldn't have kids. The problem is it's not PC to say it, but for me personally my mental health is a large part in my decision not to reproduce (especially as the one time I did believe I was pregnant I became erratic to the brink of violent). It would be horrible to enforce it, but a little self-knowledge goes a long way.

Ultimately, however, I believe that the person who did that most likely believed that his family would be better off, no matter how irrational it sounds. Because that's what depression does to your brain. It warps your thoughts and our perceptions of reality.

To me the real tragedy is that apparently no-one saw this coming.

It's because they don't believe depression is a disease. They think it's just being sad sometimes. They don't understand that it is a debilitating illness that can, and does, kill people, because they can't see it happening.

They see someone battling cancer, doing chemo, losing weight, losing their hair, and say the person's so brave. Then the person dies, and they say "He/She fought hard up until the end."

They see someone battling depression, going to work, buying groceries, fighting invisible battles in their mind, wanting to die, wanting to cry, wanting the torment to stop, and they don't say anything, unless the person expresses some sentiment of unhappiness, and then they say, "Cheer up." And then the person dies, and they say, "He/She was selfish, and gave up."

Yeah. I have chronic depression (plus chronic pain and anxiety, woohoo!) and go back and forth on being suicidal. A lot of people just really don't get it at all.

Plus, this all often totally ignores what the suicidal person's life is actually like.

Personally, when I was at the height of my suicidal urges, I was homeless, living with no healthcare and no way to get medicare b/c I had to lie about my under-the-table employment (a job I had to keep b/c anxiety and a lack of transportation), with serious dental problems, slowly starving to death b/c the food bank only gives you a certain amount of food per month and much of it was already rotten and the rest wasn't enough to feed our entire family, and being the sole provider for both my abusive family and an abusive girlfriend.

I was lucky enough to get out. It DID 'get better' for me. Marginally and after years and years of living hell. But how many people are living lives that won't get better? A shitton of people have conditions that aren't just going to go away, or if they do maybe that person doesn't want to wait years for it to happen.

I'm not saying suicide is a good idea. I think every suicidal person should try to get outside help and talk to someone qualified about the problems they're facing and what options they have. Because it's a choice you can't unmake once you're dead. But getting on some high horse about suicide doesn't help anyone. Ignoring depression, mental illness, addiction, lack of healthy relationships, whatever issue that person has? It's just fucked up.

Knowing how much I would hurt people is the only thing stopping my suicide thoughts in their tracks. No matter how much I want to die, I don't want to fuck other people up for it. They don't deserve to go through that, they try so hard to support me and even if it doesn't work, the least I can do to repay them is not traumatize them.

So yes, it does work, idk.

While that might be true for you, you do deserve your problems to be taken seriously, and for them not to be ignored in favor of what's good for our family.

..for some people.

That reasoning doesn't work for me because my very existence is a drain on the resources of both my family and society at large.

My death would free them from that responsibility.

When I'm at my danger point, it seems perfectly reasonable to save them from the constant worry and stress that is my continued existence. I have to use other avenues to keep fighting.

Just like therapy and medication, there is no one-size-fits-all for depression.

obviously

Maybe that works on some people.

was what i was responding to

I get it.

Suicide, I suppose, is a selfish act. But the person committing it deserves compassion. To speak to/of them as though they have no right to their emotional state is to ignore their inner struggles.

Yeah, I've never understood the "it's selfish" attitude, either. I've never been there, I have no idea what's going on in a suicidal person's mind, so I don't think it's my place to judge or condemn them for their actions. Novel concept, I know. Pretty much the only thing I feel whenever I hear about a suicide is sadness, because it's a sad situation all around. I feel bad for the person who took their own life, and I feel bad for the family and friends left behind struggling to find answers and deal with the tragic loss.

I can even understand family and friends feeling some irrational anger at their loved one who killed themselves because of the grief process. Emotions after a death are weird and one's reaction is not always fair or makes sense.

But complete strangers passing judgment on someone they don't know? No. Sorry. They need to shut up and mind their own business.

Hell, I tried to tell my mom I was dealing with suicidal thoughts a couple months ago (I haven't even done anything yet) and she yelled at me for being selfish. That's all. It made me feel worse, and I feel has pushed me deeper into depression, makes me feel like my existences is selfish in general or I am inherently selfish person or something. Idk why people think depressed people need to be guilted about their depression, it doesn't actually make us feel better.

You aren't selfish for existing, or trying to speak to your mom about your feelings. Nor should you feel guilty about expressing how you feel. It is totally okay to be depressed and to try to communicate that with someone and anyone who gets mad at you for that is in the wrong.

Nearly every single person alive has or will have depression at some point in their lives, it's an illness that's damn near as universal as the flu. To yell at you for that is as stupid as yelling at you for having a cold.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

[ SECRET POST #3227 ]

Trigger warning for suicide (non-explicit)

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Shit Stream: Quality Control?

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To be fair...

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