[ SECRET POST #3358 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #3358 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 093 secrets from Secret Submission Post #480.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[harp]

I'm just happy that the internet is latching on to the term SJW so well. Distinguishing them from people who simply want others to be treated fairly is so important. This way when SJWs start mouthing off and being bullies, they're classified as their own thing and it doesn't hurt the cause as much because we can go "that's just an SJW; disregard them".

[(Anonymous)]

Is this post a joke? The meaning of 'SJW' has been watered down to nothing. You'll get called an SJW for implying that the world is even remotely unfair.

[harp]

In your experience, maybe. I find that if I get specific about a problem and I don't word things in a way that could imply that whoever I'm talking to goes around setting minorities on fire, people tend to agree with me. In the end, most people do believe in equality; they just don't like being accused of being the problem. In fact, wherever possible, I try to word things so as to make them see that they can be part of the solution. It just takes a bit of diplomacy. The thing to always keep in mind if that people don't like to be made to feel bad about themselves.

Sure, there's always the odd person that you absolutely can't talk to, but I've always found that if I run into them, it becomes very clear to anyone reading our discussion that said person is being an uncooperative, pugnacious troll, and so long as I remain polite and positive in the face of their nastiness, that person looks like the asshole and other people will jump in to tell said person how much they suck.

[(Anonymous)]

coddling oppression and treating privileged groups with kids gloves in the hopes that they'll like you and just decide to treat you fairly historically does not work.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

So if you don't think treating people the way you want to be treated works, fellow anon, what do you suggest?

[(Anonymous)]

There is a difference between coddling and civility. If your first response to conflict is to throw a tantrum like a toddler who wants a cookie, no one will take you seriously.

ayrt

[(Anonymous)]

I know there is, exactly my point.

[(Anonymous)]

lol

when people say this it tells me they don't know shit about how to actually persuade people and are probably piss poor activists who just like shouting at people for justifiable and moral reasons.

To actually persuade people you need to be able to shelve your outrage or your ego or whatever and be able to be humble and look at the person you're talking to and trying to persuade as a person and not the enemy.

You need to be clever and self aware, able to at least appear open minded, and humble, to persuade anyone. You need to not see them as one of the same as the "bad guys" , not "the Oppressor" but a person.

When I say you have to be humble I don't mean you need to agree with and accept horrible bigoted behavior, of course. What I mean is, you need to be willing to accept that they won't just understand you in the way you think they ought to. Which a lot of people who whine about not "coddling egos/feelings" or whatever, refuse to do. Instead of stamping your feet and complaining when they don't understand your point the first time, you need to be able to stop and think to find a method that will work.

Here's a fact , most people don't like to feel bad. It's a natural reflex of the brain to avoid that feeling for a lot of people. It doesn't matter if you think they deserve to, making them feel bad because they don't agree with your right belief is only going to result in them walking away, and being hostile to the ideology you're trying to force on them.

Example: There was a PSA movie a while ago called "All You Need Is Love" that showed people what gay and lesbian people go through by showing a straight person in a world where gay is the norm. A lot of people complained about this method of "making gay people's struggles all about straight people" and how it was offensive. But guess what, for some people it worked. There were a lot of people who responded with variations of "I get it now" and understanding.

People griped about how it was wrong and sad that it takes this to get them to understand. But it worked. Maybe it didn't work the way some people think it ought to have, but it made viewers who were probably ignorant understand what it's like to be in a world where they're told that their feelings are wrong. For some people putting themselves in someone else's shoes (which is literally what they did, they ended the movie with a message about how it was based on the experiences of gay people.) It did the equivalent of asking someone "how would you feel if people treated you that way for being straight?"

It's not "coddling oppression" nor is it "treating privileged groups with kid gloves". We're talking about being civil to people and not trying to change their mind with hostility and telling them they're the problem for being part of a group.

If civility is coddling to you, you're not going to do anything but drive people who might understand away.

[(Anonymous)]

if you don't think that terrible "All You Need is Love" short movie was anything but handling a group with kid gloves, you're delusional tbh. it's practically the definition of it.

[harp]

Oh yeah, and acting like an asshole, treating people who make mistakes like they're the next Hitler, and being angry at everyone and everything and seeing every member of a particular group as an enemy does so much to further the cause. I'd rather be nice to everyone because guess what? I'm not going to allow someone else's dickish behavior make me act like a dick. If you go around being nasty to everyone you deem "an oppressor" then I have news for you- they've won. You let hatred poison you, and influence your behavior, and the hate wins.

But please, do continue being nasty to people who you think "deserve" it. That definitely doesn't hurt the cause at all. No, more hatred and mistrust and ugliness in the world is just what we need, so continue pumping it out by the gallon.

[feotakahari]

Ever hang out on Know Your Meme? Entire categories of bigotry and injustice can't be discussed there in any fashion without being dismissed as "SJW bullshit."

[harp]

I've hung out on KYM, but like I said up there, so long as I cite specific instances and don't try to convince people that they themselves are oppressive monsters, I get along just fine. The only notable instance I can think of was some guy who wrote a huge paragraph about how he didn't mind gay marriage, but he didn't like gays getting special rights. I asked him to give an example of a special right, and he deleted his comment and wrote that he didn't like it when gays tried to make him tolerate things he didn't want to tolerate. I asked him for an example of that, too, and he never replied. Iunno, I kinda see that as a victory for the rainbow side of things, but maybe I'm the only person who would see it that way.