fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #3812 ]

[ SECRET POST #3812 ]

⌈ Secret Post #3812 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 38 secrets from Secret Submission Post #546.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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This is total bait considering M/M ships with large age gaps are WAY more pppular in fandom lol.

But are they more popular relative to the popularity of f/f and m/m in general?

Not that it matters either way, I'm honestly just curious.

AYRT

Yes, they definitely are.

Like... explain more? I'm honestly just interested in where you're coming from! It doesn't seem clear to me either way.

AYRT

I'm not making a value judgement or anything, but I feel like a lot of people in fandom are obsessed with f/f ships being "pure," while these judgements don't necessarily apply as much to M/M or M/F ships. Like, I'm not even really familiar with the ships in question that the OP listed, but how old are the younger women supposed to be in these relationships? Mid to late 20s? That's really nothing. I've seen many, many popular M/M and M/F ships where the younger party (and in the case of M/F, it's usually a younger woman) is barely legal or not legal at all lol.

Well two things I guess

One, are we talking about how popular the dynamics of age gap relationships are? Or are we talking about how big the age gap is? I kinda feel like the first thing is more significant - so even though both relationships OP mentioned are with 20-somethings, the dynamics of both ships are all about the age-gap trope and experience/inexperience and authority/submission.

Second, I think it's also relevant to take account how frequently age-gap dynamics appear in lesbian-oriented media outside of fandom strictly speaking. It's such a common trope, you know?

AYRT

Sure, but the M/M age gap ships I know are popular tend to play on the experience/inexperience and authority/submission thing too.

Yes, and this actually does frustrate me, but the OP was talking about fandom -- not specifically lesbian media, so I was kind of irked by this.

NAYRT

Yeah but....a relationship with someone who isn't legal is a different thing than a "May - December" relationship. I mean, sometimes they might overlap (and the secret maker does seem to be conflating the two), but a May - December relationship is just referring to a large age gap between the two. It doesn't have anything to do with legality.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2017-06-11 21:14 (UTC) - Expand

a lot of people in fandom are obsessed with f/f ships being "pure,"

I'm darkly amused by what they would have thought of the Damages fandom, back in the day.

What M/M ships with large age gaps are more popular? Honestly curious....the only one I can think of right now is Tony/Gibbs (NCIS).

Hotch/Reid is quite popular in the "Criminal Minds" fandom.

And it's not a popular ship, but I also very occasionally see a bit of Rossi/Reid pop up here and there.

I knew Hotch/Reid was popular, but since I don't watch the show, it hadn't occurred to me that there was a large age gap. Thanks for the reply!

AYRT

The ships OP is complaining about have 900-2k fics on AO3. Ships like Levi/Eren and Snape/Harry have 9k-11k fics, respectively.

I should have thought of Snape/Harry. *facepalm* I don't know what the other one you mentioned is though.

Attack on Titan.
Levi = 30+
Eren = 15

DA

That drives me fucking nuts.

Wait what I thought they were both in their early 20s

Is that honestly canon?
It always seemed super weird to me considering Levi looks to only be a few years older then Eren, at most.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2017-06-12 01:07 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2017-06-12 19:06 (UTC) - Expand

But there are way fewer F/F fics than M/M fics across the board. F/F is just way less popular than M/M in general (for fairly obvious and non-controversial reasons). Like, Supercat is nowhere near as popular as large M/M ships, but Supergirl is one of the most popular f/f fandoms and Supercat was one of the most popular ships within it, and would probably be one of the most popular f/f ships overall if it hadn't been superceded within the show because Calista Flockhart left the cast. You really have to take into account the comparative popularity of f/f and m/m.

AYRT

Yes...I realize there's going to be more content for M/M ships. However, there are still more popular age gap M/M ships than F/F ships in fandom. Do you want me to make a spreadsheet that proves this? Frankly, I've always thought this was obvious.

There are also more popular M/M ships, and more M/M ships in general, in fandom. The question is whether there are more popular M/M age-gap ships proportionate to the popularity of M/M ships in general than there are popular F/F age-gap ships proportionate to the popularity of F/F in general.

And I don't know the answer, and it very well might be that age gap is more popular in M/M, but let's at least compare like to like.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2017-06-11 21:16 (UTC) - Expand

Off topic, but....it is interesting to speculate what might have happened if Calista Flockhart had stayed, but they still brought Katie McGrath in. Did SuperCorp explode like it did because of the absence of SuperCat, or would it still have happened?

I suspect the only reason that that Destiel doesn't get called problematic because Castiel is thousands, if not millions, of years older than Dean, is because "yeah but at least it doesn't have a guy banging the younger brother he literally raised" is too effective a retort.

I actually came here to say the M/M ships like this are getting huge amounts of shit now from fandom gatekeepers who think every age difference is pedophilia, and it's also getting traction for the gatekeepers to bring in the stereotype the OP's worried about in order to tell people why they should stop liking those ships.

And meanwhile this secret is the first time I've known of anyone having the same issue with it when it comes to F/F. Fandom gatekeepers are silent on the issue of F/F pairings with big age differences and power imbalances, and a lot even hyopcritically ship some themselves.

AYRT

Tbh, I disagree with your assessment. Fandom gatekeepers/anti-shippers are honestly just young adults and teens who need a lot of attention because they probably don't have any friends IRL. That's why they generally go after M/M and M/F ships since they tend to be way more popular than F/F ships. Why whine about a "problematic" F/F ship when no one is going to give a shit? These people feed off attention.

Also, for many of these anti-shippers, shipping F/F is rather performative. "True femslashers," who are actually invested in F/F and read/write fic, usually keep to themselves. I sincerely doubt there are many femslashers who ship F/F with large age gaps like the OP listed above that spend their time being anti-shippers/fandom gatekeepers.

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