Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2018-05-20 03:38 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2018-05-20 03:38 pm
[ SECRET POST #4155 ]
⌈ Secret Post #4155 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 40 secrets from Secret Submission Post #595.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
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It might work in some cases but by in large I'll be like 'nah the mass murderer isn't the one who needs to rethink shit', but fandom's gonna do what it does so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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(Anonymous) 2018-05-20 09:08 pm (UTC)(link)no subject
But ultimately #NakiaWasRight.
(Tbh I actually quite liked Killmonger because while he was totally down with the murder, it came from a place of wanting to help people who couldn't help themselves or have the means to, now he went the wrong way about it and would go too far, but I get where he was coming from).
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(Anonymous) 2018-05-20 10:59 pm (UTC)(link)Nakia makes all the points Erik makes, only with less misogyny -- killing your girlfriend, really? -- hatred, and civil war.
(I also think Erik was an AMAZING villain; I loved every moment of him on screen. What a drama queen, too! By far the best antagonist I think the MCU has come up with of late.)
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(I just loved how I could totally see how he ended up the way he did, and if life had given him a different hand he would have been different. He was a clear case of nature vs nurture and I really enjoyed that. Plus he was also so damn fun 'hi auntie', like yes, I could watch you smarm while inciting a civil war for hours).
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(Anonymous) 2018-05-21 03:28 am (UTC)(link)I don't necessarily consider him killing his girlfriend misogyny...to me it was a case of being about the cause -- he will love the cause, care about the cause and his objectives more than he will love anyone else, and is willing to sacrifice everything (his entire life has been dedicated to reaching this goal, lol you [anyone] thought you'd somehow be more important? ) even someone like his girlfriend. I'll take the leap in saying she was either down to ride for the cause or willing to sacrifice herself as well. That is to say, she knew what it was when she signed up. Or at least figured out that he is consumed by his objective when she was blowing up buildings to help him escape. I have no trouble believing that if he had a man for a partner, he would have been willing to sacrifice him as well. Thus why I wouldn't consider his killing his girlfriend misogyny. I didn't see it as active hate toward a woman. Just a casualty/ sacrifice for his goals.
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(Anonymous) 2018-05-21 04:53 am (UTC)(link)no subject
(Anonymous) 2018-05-21 06:01 am (UTC)(link)I think that his obsession is more with his cause, with the injustices he has seen and experienced, and his intense desire to right them. That T'Challah is a face for the personal wrongs done to him, and very much has the tools to right the wrongs -- just exacerbates his feelings. Just my opinion, of course!
But I definitely see where you're coming from. Another one in the vein of Joker/Batman, Master/Doctor, and whoever else has been mentioned (Magnet/Charles?). It's not my ship, but enjoy it!
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(Anonymous) 2018-05-21 06:39 am (UTC)(link)no subject
(Anonymous) 2018-05-21 10:39 am (UTC)(link)I wouldn't call that moment misogyny per se (although coupled with the scene where he chokes out the priestess for no reason, it is kind of ehhh), but I do think that Erik killing his girlfriend is something worth examining in closer detail if people are going to be writing fic about the character. As I always say, if you're a fictional character and you want to kill half the world, that could be ideological, but if you want to kill your lover, that's pathological. She was useful to him and seemed to care about him -- he shot her anyway, just because she was in the way. It wasn't even a situation where the stakes were particularly high and there were no other options. So yeah, what do we think about that, a character who would shoot an intimate partner just because it's convenient? I don't think you can put all of it behind the idea that he's all about the cause. Some of that has got to be on him.
I still freaking love the character and want to read fic about him, but I've found all of one story that seriously attempts to deal with the consequences of that moment :\
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(Anonymous) 2018-05-21 03:53 pm (UTC)(link)I think you make a really good point, and it's definitely worth deeper examination. I never really thought of it in terms of an ideological vs pathological impetus (although I guess I kind of did, attributing much of his actions as a dedication to an ideology).
I saw the moment as she lost her usefulness -- what good could she have done for him in Wakanda? And if he did care for her, in a way, I could see how he might have seen it a small mercy to kill her himself and not letting the other man kill her. She would not fall to the hands of the enemy (recall his own end). This is, if we're assuming he cares for her. I also think you may be placing too much on her character. Which in a way is the issue -- as far as the movie showed, there were only two central characters to his life, two people he was obsessed with (his father and T'Challah). Everyone else was a pawn to be used until their expiration. Even his cousin was a means for him to get what he wanted. As an audience member, I ask myself how much was I supposed to care about the Bonnie to his Clyde (I assumed she would be Bonnie) but then I realized this is all about him (and the cause yes)...what I'm trying to say is that the way it was staged, everything is about him. Other people, in his life, come second. And while women are clearly important, the focus is on the men. As they are the main characters, I suppose.
But I agree there is validity in exploring his actions as pathological. Sorry if I rambled or contradicted myself there; it's fun to have discussions about these things!
As far as the priestess goes, agreeing it was overkill, but that's kind of his style, and I figured he was doing it to prevent anyone else from receiving the gift of the Panther -- if you want to kill a people, or control them, you erase their culture, practices. Eliminating the priestess (since the priest was dead already, no?) ensured that the ritual could have no one to execute it. Along with burning the flowers, so truly, there could be no ritual.
Just my five cents, lol.
And that sucks that there's only one fic dealing with that moment in a serious manner :/ Hopefully you find more!
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(Anonymous) 2018-05-21 03:20 am (UTC)(link)