Case (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
case) wrote in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
fandomsecrets2008-09-20 05:03 pm
case) wrote in fandomsecrets2008-09-20 05:03 pm
[ SECRET POST #624 ]
⌈ Secret Post #624 ⌋
Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.
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Notes:
I'm not even going to bother posting the obvious trolls any more.
CITY STUFF → [ pop com ]
Secrets Left to Post: 21 pages, 515 secrets from Secret Submission Post #090.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 2 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ], [ 1 2 - posted twice ], [ 1 - I don't know what this is trying to say ], [ 1 - warning that we're on Portal of Evil (we've known for months) ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.
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As far as the ladies go, the only female I felt was handled well was Izumi Curtiss. Winry, Riza, RanFan, even Lust, were all treated terribly. Winry is both 'The Girl Back Home' and 'The Childhood Best Friend.' Arakawa also faces the problem with Winry that she can't seem to decide what kind of person she wants Winry to be; is she the strong, independent girl who can stand on her own or is she the crybaby who needs to be protected? She has some insane mood swings and to such an extreme level that it's far more noticeable and annoying and it never seems to change. She never seems to really grow. In fact, in some ways she takes some steps back. The whole scenario with her and Scar was flashy and visually powerful but it was so completely over-the-top in a way that, for me, was just bad and didn't really seem to match Winry's character. It bugged me particularly because in the anime, her reaction to finding out that Roy, someone she knew and respected, killed her parents wasn't nearly as intense as her reaction to Scar. And of course, who is the one to calm her down and protect her? Ed. This is pretty similiar to the Lust v. Riza scene, which pretty much ruined everything I liked about her. Riza is a smart woman, so why, when Lust tells her that she's killed Roy and has no proof whatsoever to back up her claim, does Riza believe her without a doubt and decide that she's got no reason left to live? She uses all her bullets trying to kill Lust and when that fails, falls to her knees and sobs that she has no reason left to go on living. That's not the Riza I'd known for 10 volumes of manga and a 50 episode anime. Not even close. And then of course Roy comes in all badass, having just burned his own flesh to stop the bleeding, and saves Riza in addition to getting the glory of sending Lust to her grave. And yes, Roy calls Riza out on her behavior, but Riza doesn't at all change from this experience. She doesn't grow. At all.
And RanFan has little to no personality. She's there more or less to be Ling's love interest and they fit the typical Master/Servant stereotype to a T. Roy/Riza do, too.
Ultimately, my biggest issue with the manga is that visually, yes, it's amazing and tops the anime by a mile. When I think of the anime in terms of things that visually stand out to me, I really can't think of anything. The manga? I can think of lots of things. But that flashyness comes at the expense of the characters and rarely have any sort of emotional impact to back it up (the scenes I mentioned above being a good example of this, as well as Hughes and Nina's deaths and the revelation of Envy's true form. Pride, too.) And I say all this as someone who read the manga and fully expected to like it far more than the anime and was genuinely disappointed.
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I never liked Ran Fan. To be honest, she's probably one of my least favourite FMA characters. She's a cardboard cutout of a character with no personality and, like you said, is there to give Ling some romantic drama. And that's about it.
Winry has never really stood out that much to me; I think she pretty much fits the 'Hero's Love Interest' stereotype to a T and to me, that cheapens her (I know we're analysing the manga here but, honestly, the 3rd anime ending with her posed suggestively all over the screen didn't really help my opinion). But I personally have never cared that much about her or her development, so I really don't have too much to say. But I agree about the whole Roy vs. Scar thing, and how her reaction to Scar was somewhat ridiculous considering she didn't even confront Roy in the anime (if she did, apologies, it's been a few years since I saw it).
Now, the female character I always admired throughout the anime was Riza. She was my favourite, and I loved her strength, resolve and determination. She gave me hope that it's possible for a shounen series to have female characters that exist for more than just fanservice or to be the 'Hero's Girl'. However, in the manga, she frustrated me. That scene with Lust was a pretty big reason. At first, I thought her breakdown was very dramatic and I liked it, but as I pondered it a little more I realised how, well, out of character it seemed. I had always admired Riza for her coolheadedness, and the fact that she, like you said, completely believed Lust and decided to breakdown and cry about it was rather...well, disappointing. I mean, I know about how she's promised to protect Roy and all that jazz but jesus woman, see the body and get some confirmation before you start bawling! (And preferably finish the battle first, too.) The fact that she just gave up really let me down.
So yeah. I stopped reading a little bit further on then you did, and I have to say that Olivia Armstrong is amazing, but she wasn't enough to keep me interested in the manga. I think I'll just stick to the anime.
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I also did like Winry in the anime, mostly because I did enjoy her platonic relationship with the brothers and the potential for a completely fucked-up relationship with Roy (though the movie frustrated me as far as she's concerned because I hated the way it portrayed her as being oh so hung up on Ed.) But yeah, manga!Winry has just been written and developed terribly. (And yes, she did confront Roy but the focus was more on Roy than on her because it was when he went to yell at the Elrics about never asking for his help, etc.)
I never cared much for Riza, simply because I don't find her character type appealing but I did always appreciate her and what she brought to the series. So to see what she was reduced to in the manga was just disheartening. The whole Lust fiasco pissed me off (not only because of what it did to Riza but because what the hell, was Lust's whole purpose in this series just to die?) So disappointing.
I'll be sticking to the anime, too. Everything I've heard about what happens later in the manga has turned me off from it more and more (particularly Pride. What the hell.)
AND COMPLETELY OFF-TOPIC BUT PIEDMON. *A*
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Oh boy, agreeing with everything you just said about Winry. I think I like her relationship with the brothers far more when it's just platonic. It gives her more depth as a character. And inorite? The Winry/Roy potential for mindfuck was huge but then the movie made them both hung up on Ed and that kind of disappointed me. A lot. (But I still thought the movie was epic.) Ah, I knew she must have confronted Roy, but it's annoying that it wasn't about her parents. Honestly, Roy killing her parents was so much more deep and dramatic than some random Ishbalan (sorry, Scar, but you've never thrilled me either) topping them off.
And pride is just shota bait. Srsly.
what the hell, was Lust's whole purpose in this series just to die?
This. The whole treatment of the homunculi in the manga pissed me off.
AND I AM SUCH A PIEDMON FANTARD IT ISN'T FUNNY AND OH MY LAWD DIGIMON @_@
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The Ed/Winry relationship in the manga makes me see red, good God. It's so badly written. And the platonic relationship between the three of them in the anime was so much more interesting. And she did confront Roy about killing her parents. He was acting cold and distant or something (I haven't watched this episode in awhile, forgive me for not being more clear on this!) and she was like, "Was that what you were like when you killed my parents?!" and Riza steps in and stops her before she can carry on and really call him out. And Scar, to me, has always just been there. To be there. Yeah.
WHO THOUGHT MAKING THAT KID PRIDE WAS A GOOD IDEA? SERIOUSLY. Not just for the shota but for God's sake, if you're gonna have one of the Big Bads be someone we already know and have it be a big mystery and such, at least make it someone we care about. Having it be that kid that appeared once or twice is just stupid. B|
This. The whole treatment of the homunculi in the manga pissed me off.
Basically.
DIGIMON OH MY GOD. I JUST REWATCHED THE FIRST TWO SEASONS RECENTLY. OH GOD, STILL THE BEST SHOW EVER. THANK YOU. ♥
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It's like...I don't even know where the hell Ed/Winry is going in the manga. Seriously. WHAT ARE THEY DOING?! It's like one second they're all lovey dovey 'I will protect you' shoujo style, and the next they're, well, not. It's like the pairing had moodswings or something. Idk. But like I said, I was never really a fan.
Dude, at least you remembered there was a confrontation! (I kind of really wanted Winry to take a wrench to Roy or something equally dramatic/angsty, but I fear Riza might have shot her (...which would open the way for moar drama/angst! I like this plan!)). And yeah, Scar. Yep. Him. That guy. Who..I don't really give a shit about. He's just...yep, there. Awesome. =/ Woo.
Lmfao, that was my reaction! When he was revealed as Pride, I was all 'who's this kid again? Oh, right! I knew that.' Yeah, not really very exciting stuff. Made for fun shoops, though. (http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2wq7i9h&s=4)
WHY HELLO THERE ICON! DIGIMON 01 OH MY LAWD I LOVE IT SO MUCH. Srsly. Just looking at this icon makes me feel all nostalgic and ;_______; BEST. SHOW. EVER I AM RAISING MY KIDS ON THIS SHIT.
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I disagree with you on the treatment of the homunculi - the anime explanation didn't make as much sense, and treated the Gate as nothing more than a semi Deus ex Machina to a very large extent. What bothered me the most was that the whole point of the anime was "right that Equivalent Exchange business we kept on about? IT WAS ALL BULL, LOLOL". Which I didn't like. And the thing is that later on in the manga we are definitely seeing the homunculi manifest as characters in and of themselves, and not completely subservient to Father. And what I like about them in the manga is that they are perfectly capable of being pwned by humans, through human ingenuity - as opposed to the anime, where they were treated like demigods, and had to be weakened through all sorts of external elements before humans could even touch them. The futility of humanity in the anime was really darn depressing, for me.
I also like the manga's treatment of both Ed and Al much more than I like the anime's. But then, Roy in the manga is more of a douche, I think, than he is in the anime. And Winry ... while I agree that there were several badly-done and slightly melodramatic scenes with her, I like the fact that we see her living her own life in Rush Valley, and working on herself - and becoming very proactive in the scenes with Scar, Kimblee, and later on. She becomes important for herself, not just as the Childhood Friend, which I felt the anime relegated her to.
Personally, a lot of the plot elements of the anime just seemed more melodramatic, and thus ended up weaker, in my opinion. There were many scenes that it seemed to me they milked for as much drama as they could, and for no real reason. Like the 5th laboratory, and the Nina episode.
I guess I'm trying to say that there ARE some sane manga fans? And while I'm really excited over the new anime, I do agree though that retconning essentially the entire anime sucks. There were a lot of things the anime did that were very good, and it remains one of the best anime series I've ever watched, and one of my favorites. Throwing it away entirely is not fair treatment, imho.
sorry for the tl;dr
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Just dropping by to agree with this sentiment. I loved the FMA anime so much; it breaks my heart that they seem to be retconning the whole thing. ;_;
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