fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #5014 ]

[ SECRET POST #5014 ]

⌈ Secret Post #5014 ⌋

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I feel like the "burn Ellen" trend is really obnoxious, to be honest. She's the first openly lesbian mega-celebrity and (my fellow) liberal community wants to burn her at the first chance because she's "so toxic." Sounds to me like enough people didn't pile on for the first round of BS when people were terribly offended she was friends with a repub and now they'll find some other thing to cancel her about.

Eh. I'm not shedding any tears fo her. I think she did need to be called out because, at the end of the day it is her is her show, but the pile is a bit over the top. Can you imagine the excuses if shit like that went down on Stephen Colbert's or John Oliver's shows?

FFS.

I don't care if she's a lesbian and personally nice. She shouldn't get a free pass on running a workplace that ended up treating its workers like shit. What the fuck kind of logic is that? We should hold everyone accountable for stuff like that.

And you can feel free to disagree with people on this, but let's at least be clear about what we're talking about here with the Republican thing. The objection is not that she was friends with a Republican. The objection is that she was palling around with George W. Bush specifically, who started an illegal war in Iraq that killed thousands of Americans and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis, and who was generally the precursor to many of the things that we rightly condemn from Trump. And moreover, that her friendship with him is part of a process of the nation is forgetting all of that stuff about Bush, a process that's really harmful to our domestic politics because it's basically promoting an illusion.

It just seems like these are the kinds of empty excuses that people make for any celebrity they like.

FFS it's not like the woman was personally harassing anyone. For the record, I DON'T like her, but the reaction is LUDICROUS.

She was responsible for the organization as a whole, she saw the kind of toxic treatment and bullying and she was aware of the working conditions, and she didn't do anything about it. It was her responsibility as the person in charge of the whole thing to take that kind of thing seriously, and she didn't. That's a bad thing to do. It is bad. Shitty workplace cultures are bad and she, as the person in overall charge of the workplace, allowed it to be shitty and enabled people who were bullies.

I don't see, at all, how the reaction is ludicrous.

I think it's bizarre to fixate on her just because she's the biggest name involved instead of the people who were actually guilty of harassing or demeaning their subordinates.

Because a person at the top overlooking and excusing toxic behavior is how toxic behavior is able to exist and continue for long periods of time. And because we in this country are already far too inclined to give powerful people passes for things like this, especially ones that are celebrities, and far too willing to just shrug our shoulders and not care about the rights of workers.

Are the harassing, demeaning executives more morally culpable than Ellen, yes, absolutely. But Ellen is also morally culpable. And if we want to have a culture that actually takes the rights of workers seriously, we have to hold people in Ellen's position accountable for failures like this, not just let them off the hook as if it's "just a few bad apples".

Thank you, ffs.

I'm sure the employees who were abused by her exec producers appreciate that Ellen was only unaware of the toxic culture on her set and didn't personally harass them.

How is someone who is not aware of or personally guilty of something responsible for it at the same time?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negligence

Negligence of a group of adults. Okay.

I don't understand how that's a mitigating factor.

You said she wasn't aware of it. If she was not aware of it, she should have been aware of it. It was her responsibility as a person in charge of the workplace to be aware of it. So her being unaware of it is not an excuse, because in being unaware of it, she was neglecting her responsibility as the person in charge of the workplace.

She isn't in charge of the workplace, though? You're really showing that you have zero idea of what show business is really like. She's the face, and she gets the final vote on things written for the show. Like, end of. She's not the boss.

I understand being protective of her, lord knows people hate lesbians, but come on. Not caring what goes on in a workplace that has *her* name on it is not a good look to say the least.

NAYRT

What suggests she doesn't care though?

Well, she didn't do anything about it until it became a national news story

So either she didn't care enough to do anything about it, or she didn't care enough to know that it was going on

She made a public apology, so on the public side, there's nothing else she can do.

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She has an executive producer credit and, by all accounts, is heavily involved in the creative side of the show at the very least. This is not a case where all she does is show up, get on stage and read her lines.

Also, per accounts, she literally witnessed instances of her executives bullying people and did nothing.

Aren't there people claiming that she herself could be pretty unpleasant to her employees and sometimes to the guests on the show?

If I may also add, GWB was also behind extremely homophobic "pro family" legislature and conversion therapy flourished underneath his presidency. Somehow this keeps getting lost in the outrage.

He personally was against gay marriage. Ellen is a married gay woman. It's like, say, if Terry Crews was seen palling around with David Duke. It goes way beyond just "A difference of opinion." It's not just "A Republican" it's a homophobic Republican who personally hates LGBT+ people and made it harder for us to live.

It almost sounds like GWB has mellowed and is not a monolithic structure of pure homophobia. Hate him, too, but he's not an actual nazi.

+1. The pure black-and-white "good" vs. "actually Satan" thing is getting tiresome. And I'm a lesbian myself.

Thinking George W Bush is evil does not mean that you believe in "pure black and white good vs actually Satan" morality

You can believe that there are shades of grey in morality, and also think that George W Bush is evil

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