[ SECRET POST #6015 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6015 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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[Cursed Princess Club]



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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 37 secrets from Secret Submission Post #860.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

The toxic trait is expecting other people manage your emotions for you.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh good, we don't need to tag for gore, rape, epilepsy, child abuse, self harm, etc etc etc. /s

[(Anonymous)]

"I don't like you meeting up with your ex after work. Can you stop?"

Okay, sure. That's reasonable.

"I don't like you having friends. Can you ditch them all?"

What? No. That's an unreasonable request.

"But you found my last request reasonable. Therefore, you must find this one reasonable as well."

That's not right. Some requests are reasonable, and some are not.

"No. If you find one request reasonable, then you must find them all to be so. All requests are exactly the same."

That's not true at all!

"Wow. You're a jerk!"

[(Anonymous)]

We can't allow gay marriage! Next it will be bestiality!!!1!eleventy!!1 They're exactly the same! I am very smart.

[(Anonymous)]

AYRT

That's the exact attitude I'm arguing against, anon.

"You have to support bestiality, because you support gay marriage" is a stupid position; gay marriage is reasonable, bestiality is not. Just like some requests are reasonable, and others are not.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

I figured that anon was being sarcastic.

[(Anonymous)]

Bingo.

anti-tagging anon up there sounds just like the anti-gay bigots.


We can't have a general standard of tagging, otherwise every person on the planet will expect ME personally to manage their emotions for them!

We can't have gay marriage, otherwise I will be forced by the government to change my gender and sleep with a dog!

This is what you sound like, dude. It's called the slippery slope fallacy. A fallacy is a failure in reasoning which renders an argument invalid.

[(Anonymous)]

"People have to tag for unreality, otherwise we won't be allowed to tag for gore and rape!"

[(Anonymous)]

AYRT

No one has said you HAVE to tag. The whole point of the original secret is that they don't BELIEVE anyone who says they need it.

"I don't believe people who say they need 'unreality' tags" is the same thing as

"I don't believe people who say they need 'rape' tags."


You don't HAVE to tag for rape. We just all understand that people who don't are dicks.

[(Anonymous)]

DA

But I think you're both making compatible points. "Don't assume this tag is uniquely bullshit compared to everything else people benefit from having tagged" is fair. "Don't turn 'I like having this tagged' into a moral imperative for what other fans have to do" is also fair.

[(Anonymous)]

“I draw the line at tagging for flashing lights. No one needs that!”

[(Anonymous)]

"It is literally impossible to draw lines! Having any boundaries or standards at all is problematic!"

[(Anonymous)]

DA

Pretty sure the problem with conservatives is that they just don't want to see "consent" as a relevant way of evaluating if a behavior is morally defensible.

[(Anonymous)]

Ohhh apparently it's a toxic trait to be considerate to other people in a small way /s

[(Anonymous)]

It starts with, "just be considerate and do this small thing!" It ends with people constantly walking on eggshells, terrified to even mildly disagree with the emotional abuser that they unwittingly let into their lives. It ends with, "I'll ruin your life/kill myself if you don't do what I want."

[(Anonymous)]

Are you okay?

[(Anonymous)]

DA

But I think I know what they're objecting to, in terms of fandom. The people who started out claiming they were crusading against fanfictional incest have attacked other fans for shipping

-any kind of relationship with an age gap that supposedly reminds them of parent/child incest
-characters that canon might reveal in the future are related
-relationships that remind them of the dynamic between siblings
-characters who are not blood related, but belong to the same family for social or financial reasons
-add any examples you can think of that I'm not including here for brevity's sake!

And the people protesting fanfictional adult/child, and kids having underage sex, and adult fans writing about teenagers, and on and on have been just as unreasonable. When the community reacts with guilt and deference, the ones getting on soapboxes and haranguing just get more aggressive and find more things to demand.

The fans who made YKINMK the fandom norm (in opposition to the endless demands put on stigmatized story categories) understood this. Whereas, the amount of tagging people have been bullied into, around writing "NSFW" sex, and writing sex other people consider squicky, just make it that much easier for corporations to tell a machine selectively what to delete. If it ever comes to that. Because we did all the work of saying "this is underage, and that's incest, and over yonder are rape scenes ..." and organizing it and making it legible.

[(Anonymous)]

AYRT

Yes, but this isn't about fandom tags that antis might try to go after. The secret OP thinks the tag is unnecessary. The person the first commenter Ohhh apparently it's a toxic trait to be considerate to other people in a small way /s is responding to says that The toxic trait is expecting other people manage your emotions for you.

Tagging is not "expecting people to manage your emotions for you". Nor is it "people constantly walking on eggshells, terrified to even mildly disagree with the emotional abuser that they unwittingly let into their lives." Maybe some people USE them that way, and those people are assholes who you need to block ASAP.

BECAUSE:

Tagging is a great way for people to be able to take control of their own experiences and manage their own emotions. Rape victims can block the rape tag and not be triggered. Epileptics and block the flashing tag and avoid an episode. People with certain mental illnesses can block the unreality tag and avoid a spiral or use it as a gauge for other posts they've seen. It's just being nice. People who don't want to use tags because they thing it impinges on them somehow to show the bare minimum concern for others are functionally conservatives.

So I have to wonder, if you're posting something that you know beforehand might cause an issue with someone reading it, such as a short story that includes rape, or a gif that has flashing lights - and you think it's too much effort to throw up a tag to let people avoid harming themselves, are you okay?

[(Anonymous)]

People who are so mentally ill that coming across a lie on the internet will send them into a spiral should not be on the internet.

In the real world, we do not take the person who is least able to function and organize society around that. We assume a basic level of functionality, and find ways to sequester people who cannot function. We do this because otherwise, we would all start behaving in nonfunctional ways.

An example: there is a group of people who believe that everyone should still be taking maximum precautions against Covid at all times, and should do so until Covid is eradicated (which it never will be). If we are nice to them, we will keep the economy shut down and avoid physical contact with our fellow human beings in perpetuity. Are you willing to do that?

[(Anonymous)]

People who are so mentally ill that coming across a lie on the internet will send them into a spiral should not be on the internet.

How very abilist of you. You do realize that people can have a psychotic break out of nowhere? With no history of mental illness at all?

We assume a basic level of functionality

We don't assume shit. We make accommodations, or at least, legally we should be, going so far to even have court appointed guardians to protect people.

About covid, no one asked that. The point was to flatten the curve, and give the researchers enough time to come up with a good treatment and vaccine.

But then... you're the troll from above, aren't you? So I won't get into the science of it, since you're kinda bad at reading comprehension and basic morality, so I don't expect you to understand highschool science.


My advice: go sit with the feelings that are generating this behavior, do some introspection, and stop asking people on the internet to manage your emotions for you.

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, we make accomodations. That is not the same thing as structuring society around people being severely ill.

"About covid, no one asked that."

That's not the case at all. There are people in the Zero Covid and 100 Percenter communities who do, in fact, want what I described. I know one of them. She didn't come to a concert with us in the fall despite having bought a ticket because "Covid isn't over yet." She doesn't see any of us, because we've all moved on, which she views as reprehensible. I'm not sure she'll ever see any of us again.

You've touched on something I legitimately have a real problem with: this idea that "no one has said this," or "this has never happened." How do you know no one has said it, or that it has never happened? How can you claim it with so much confidence? What if it has been said, or has happened, and you just hadn't heard of it yet?

[(Anonymous)]

If more countries had taken even moderate isolation protocols, covid would not be endemic now.

What is *wrong* with you?

Did a MAGA fan stray onto this forum somehow?

[(Anonymous)]

Unfortunately, that doesn't appear to be true.

But it doesn't really matter either way. What matters is that it is endemic now, but there are people who think we should avoid all physical contact until it's gone. And we just can't structure society around that thought without it falling apart.

[(Anonymous)]

... that sounds like a you problem? I know people who request people use the unreality tag for certain things-- they also take responsibility for their own mental state. Making a polite request is PART of that! But no one I've seen-- because I also curate MY online space-- has ever spiraled into threats. Like... most people who need tags used aren't emotional abusers??

[(Anonymous)]

"Don't use a tag I consider ridiculous" vs. "obligatory tag use for X, Y, Z."

There's more than one way to be controlling. And I don't support either of these.