[ SECRET POST #6378 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #6378 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 42 secrets from Secret Submission Post #912.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom]

03. https://i.imgur.com/AAbSXaF.jpg

[(Anonymous)]

Try Schitt's Creek. That has a queer character and later a queer relationship, but the focus isn't on either character being queer or in a queer relationship. They just are.

Our Flag Means Death is also great for this.

[(Anonymous)]

I had the completely opposite opinion on OFmD. Like, to the point I felt it was the poster child for "look at all my queer rep box ticking, the plot is just the framework for it".

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, I've got to agree on OFMD. I enjoyed first season but it was basically ticking the boxes

[(Anonymous)]

I could NOT get into OFMD for this same reason.

[(Anonymous)]

Schitt's Creek is an excellent recommendation.

[(Anonymous)]

You are so not alone, OP.

I especially hate it when queer characters are flattened to the point where the only important thing about them is their sexuality. Like, we have other shit going on with us! We are fully realized human beings!

[(Anonymous)]

Yes. I want genre movies where the characters happen to be queer. Not movies about the characters being queer. The latter feels so...90s after-school special.

[(Anonymous)]

Well, when we get stories like this, everyone complains that they're not queer enough and just had the queer label slapped for woke points onto a character who could have been cishet without anything being different. You can't win.

[(Anonymous)]

We must be watching very different queer media, cause I haven't seen that complaint at all. I do tend to be mostly in the Eastern side of things cause I've started finding Western media boring, so that may be it.

[(Anonymous)]

I like 'the story is about being queer' and 'this story is about adventure/medical stuff/fantasy/etc but the characters are queer' but it depends on what mood I'm in as to which one I'll want to engage with. Sometimes I want a cathartic story where the problems and issues we face are presented on screen, and other times I just wanna watch something fun with queer characters. It's fine to have a preference but one is not inherently better than the other and I get exhausted when both 'sides' of this conversation act like their preference is the 'correct' one. Because a lot of people are still at this point of thinking that only One Type of Queer Rep is Allowed to exist at a time instead of realising there are multiple seats at the table.

We deserve all kinds of stories just like straight folks get.

[(Anonymous)]

Straight folks don't get, "isn't it tragic how everyone hates you, and there's no hope for you, and you're just going to die? Also, the only part of you that matters is who you fuck. You have no personality and no other interests."

[(Anonymous)]

Funnily back in the 80's and 90's those queer stories were actually helpful to get people to feel some kind of sympathy for us when thousands of us were DYING from HiV. I haven't seen a more serious look at queer struggles in recent years that wasn't from the perspective of a queer person and thus treating us as fully fledged characters despite the depressing subject matter, we get to be people now! How novel.

Also: try not being white, we absolutely did and still do get those stories sometimes so that's not an argument that works. (I am also fine with authors of colour writing those stories even if I don't always want to engage with it.)

[(Anonymous)]

Funnily back in the 80's and 90's those queer stories were actually helpful to get people to feel some kind of sympathy for us when thousands of us were DYING from HiV.

But that's completely time- and context-dependent. The fact that at one time, gay men were experiencing an epidemic and needed to get public opinion on their side in order to combat it does not mean that we need "look at the poor, tragic gays" in perpetuity.

(I am also fine with authors of colour writing those stories even if I don't always want to engage with it.)

And a lot of authors of color do not want to write those stories, but find that white publishers expect them to do so. It's fetishization of the suffering of the Other, plain and simple.

[(Anonymous)]

That's your opinion though, which I'm not disagreeing with you having but it doesn't mean that those who want to explore the sad sides of being queer are wrong or bad. It's just a difference of taste. I'm not even interested in reading every and all serious books about queer struggles, but that doesn't mean they don't get to exist or that I get to tell other people what they can create.

And there are authors of colour who do want to write about their struggles because no one group is a monolith, like that's basically a huge problem that parts of progressive online spaces are struggling with: that we all have our own perspectives and wants from media and instead of listening to each other people just yell that one perspective is bad.

Like I am not telling you that you can't enjoy happy, no queer issues queer media, and I'm not suggesting it shouldn't exist. Why would I? I like them too. But you don't get to dictate what kind of serious queer media gets to exist either. Because neither of us speak for everyone.

[(Anonymous)]

To be clear, I don't want people to be disallowed from telling those sorts of stories, especially if they want to. Rather, I want it to not feel like those sorts of stories are what's expected, because that sort of fetishization of suffering that I mentioned above often does come through. It feels sometimes like these sorts of stories are used as a way for people to assuage themselves of the guilt they feel over their privilege, rather than as a way for people to work through their struggles and speak to others who have experienced similar things.

[(Anonymous)]

That's a fair point and honestly: perhaps some people are coming from a place of guilt, but I ultimately think it's difficult for either of us to say that authors are or aren't doing this as we're not in their heads. Hell people can write something from a place of misplaced guilt without even realising it a lot of the time.

I don't personally feel like the queer-suffering stories are really the default anymore, and haven't been for a while. We don't have a hundreds of shows with us as the central characters in a plot about something else certainly, but I no longer expect queer characters to die randomly for existing in a story. They may be part of an ensemble but they get the same chance as any other character. And if you go to books, my gosh there's loads of queer stories out there, not all of them are good mind you, lol. But that's kind of the beauty of it for me, we have our guilty pleasure trash as well. xD

[(Anonymous)]

That's your opinion though, which I'm not disagreeing with you having but it doesn't mean that those who want to explore the sad sides of being queer are wrong or bad.

okay but there are tons of us whose experience with being queer HASN'T been sad or tragic and we would like to see more representations of that too instead of the default "being gay makes you miserable" shit. it gets very tiring when the default assumption is that being queer = suffering. some of us came out and got "well if you get a girlfriend then we're expecting you to bring her for thanksgiving dinner the same way we did if you had a boyfriend."

[(Anonymous)]

As I've responded to above I'm not sure what you're engaging with where sad queerness is the norm anymore? Outside of countries that sadly still have their version of the Hayes Code due to censorship, queer characters I see get to be happy, sometimes sad(because that's just stories sometimes) and everything in between. Not even happy stories lack sad moments.

And your want for happy queer stories is still your personal preference, which you are allowed to have and engage with, but you don't get to tell other queer people who want to write sadness that they aren't allowed to because you don't like it.

[(Anonymous)]

I mean, they do; there are books like that out there for straight people if they look for and want to read them. The reason for all of that is never the character's straightness, but the point is, neither "straight people don't get that" and "queer people shouldn't get that" are true. It's not all anyone should have as an option, but it doesn't mean nobody should get to have that option.

[(Anonymous)]

The reason for all of that is never the character's straightness,

Right, and that's what makes it different.

[feotakahari]

Some stuff is so stupidly, obnoxiously cisgender, even stuff that makes me want to vomit rainbows is preferable. (E.g. I’m not convinced anyone involved in writing Yakuza Kiwami ever met a trans person IRL.)

[paperghost]

I relate to this so much. I also feel like people see "is lgbt" as synonymous with "it's good". Almost every media I checked out because someone noted the lgbt content, it was either 1. not great 2. the amount of said lgbt content was exaggerated.

[(Anonymous)]

Honestly same, as a queer person. I want media in which queer romances just happen the same way het romances do, and where queer characters exist the same as any other character and their queerness is never made a big deal. I don't want the queerness to be the focus of the plot or the story, I just want queer characters to be able to exist in a universe without being the center of attention! I want it to be treated as a 100% normal and acceptable thing.

[(Anonymous)]

honestly i had thought about making a secret about this very thing last week, you beat me to it lol.

like i have no issues with a wide variety of queer stories being told, i just don't relate to a lot of Queer Media, and it leaves me feeling a little sad about that. bc i'd love to read about queer characters and queer stuff that i can relate to but so much of it just doesn't work for me.

again, not saying it shouldn't exist bc ppl relate to all kinds of things and want to tell all kinds of stories, just wishing there was more out there that i could enjoy. :(