[ SECRET POST #157 ]

[grayout.livejournal.com]

⌈ Secret Post #157 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Early for no reason, really.

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 76 secrets from Secret Submission Post #023.
Secrets Not Posted: 0 broken links, 0 not!secrets, 0 not!fandom.
Next Secret Post: Tomorrow, Tuesday, June 11th, 2007.
Current Secret Submission Post: Here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

Genuine question:

Okay, so seriously, is there really that much of a stigma with "faggot" in the rest of the country? Where I live, we throw around faggot at each other all the time a general insult with better comedic timing than "fucking idiot". My gay friends, my straight friends, all of us.

I really really doubt #19 meant it as any sort of insult to homosexuals, at least from my perspective =\

[moebot.livejournal.com]

I'm Canadian. People throw "faggot" around as a general insult all the time here... when they're in middle school. It being widespread? Doesn't make it okay to use as a "general insult" for any sort of unsavory person! The fact that your gay friends don't mind it? Doesn't make it okay to use when in a room (or comm) full of people you don't know! Because for every queer individual that doesn't mind that word or wants to reclaim it, there is a queer individual who loathes it with a fiery passion.

I suggest getting a more creative insult. I hear "Jew" and "retard" are all the rage this season.

[grayout.livejournal.com]

assface
penisclencher
buttlicker
snotmuncher
maggotbreath

[moebot.livejournal.com]

twatwaffle
cumguzzler
butterface
pillowbiter
dogfucker
etc
etc
etc

[grayout.livejournal.com]

http://www.insultmonger.com/generators/index.htm

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

Like I said, where I live (which, I assure you, is very different from where you live), I've not encountered many that view it as highly offensive. Then again, if you're gay and you live around here you have far more to worry about than possibly harmful nonsense words.

Also, it may help to clarify that it's not really used as straight up malicious insult by me or any of my friends. Mostly a typical text message of "sup faggot" is as far as it gets.

And what the hell? Put that attitude back in the cupboard; I was just asking a question.

[moebot.livejournal.com]

I only mentioned I was Canadian because of the way you worded your question, which implied that I was in whatever country you're in, and I wasn't sure that it was the same one.

"Then again, if you're gay and you live around here you have far more to worry about than possibly harmful nonsense words."
So just because someone could possibly do something worse to me than call me a name means that... I should stop being offended by those names? Please clarify.

The word "faggot" doesn't offend me when used in particular contexts. I worked backstage at a drag show, and because it was an atmosphere of comradery and we were kind of like a big, gay family, people bandied the word around no problem. But there is a big difference between a use between friends that you know won't take offense, and to make a secret in a community that has shown itself to have many queer members, and use the word as an insult within that context.

My attitude was never in the cupboard to begin with.

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

That is what I am goddamn saying.

Here, (and from what I've garnered, most everywhere else), "faggot" and "fag" has passed from nasty insult to common slang, used in everything from standard gay camraderie to "Halo is for fags". Rarely have I ever heard it used as a deliberate insult to gay people, which is apparently in stark contrast to a good few people here. Of that, I was not aware, and I doubt the secretmaker was either.

Also, I live in Tennessee, about ten miles from the county that actually banned the presence of gay people for a while. The term is so common and there are so many OTHER, far nastier words hurled for actual malicious insult that faggot does not phase many in the gay community around here.

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

My roommate and I are CONSTANTLY using it at each other, though never seriously, so it really does baffle me that other parts of the country view it as such a high offense. I mean, I've travelled and I'm cultured, but I've never looked into usage of (imo) formerly offensive nonsense words around the country.

It's weird.

And in response to the secret-maker, if people realize s/he didn't mean it insultingly at all, then I don't understand why they jump to be offended.

[iamadoughnut.livejournal.com]

Answer: yes. Yes, there is that much of a stigma. I can call myself a fag or a faggot because that's what I am, and I only ever do it in a self-deprecating way. There are certain other instances (in very particular social contexts) when I'll let "faggot" pass, though I probably shouldn't.

Then again, judging by your other comments, you're not going to get that it's insulting regardless of how you think you're using it. It's like the people who use "gay" to refer to everything they don't like. "B-but I don't hate gay people!" Yeah, well, could've fooled me. Words mean things, you see, and sometimes you have to defer to the larger culture's meaning.

[moebot.livejournal.com]

"Words mean things"
...THEY DO?!

I agree with your comment.

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

Oh my god, I get that it is insulting to some people. However, what I debating is whether it remains wholly offensive to general western culture, or whether it has finally moved into casual slang like many words before it.

So there's that.

[iamadoughnut.livejournal.com]

I will tell you right now that if what you are arguing were true there would have been no controversy over Ann Coulter or Isaiah Washington using the term to describe John Edwards and T.R. Knight (respectively).

And you are being amazingly dense over this. So your fairly narrow personal experience isn't measuring up favorably? Hmmm, let's think about this...

[(Anonymous)]

I was tempted to get involved into this particular discussion, but then I noticed your username. What an "Oh, it's them!" moment. What can I say? Wank on, kinneas, wank on.

[des-butterfly.livejournal.com]

One day, the word "faggot" will possibly get to the same stage "pussy" (as an insult for a male who is less than courageous).

Which is to say, that 5 million feminists will not come screaming out of the woodworks at you if you call a guy a "pussy", even if the connotations are extremely insulting to females.

But today is not that day.

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

Thank you. All I was wondering =\

[grayout.livejournal.com]

Just going to say that old example: replace "faggot" with "nigger" and... yeah.

I agree that they probably didn't mean like "LOL ALL THOSE HOMOSEXUAL PEOPLE" but please tell me you can still see how other people -might- be offended by them using the word?

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

Of course I can. Despite the debated possibility of the word becoming less and less offensive as its usage evolves, its roots are embedded in pure nastiness and hatred.

[grayout.livejournal.com]

*dies* Well yeah, just like the word "nigger" there are some people trying to reclaim it and others that see it as completely offensive no matter what... same thing kinda goes here I guess.

[geno0823.livejournal.com]

Despite the debated possibility of the word becoming less and less offensive as its usage evolves
Just like the word "nigger"!
...oh, wait.

Just to clarify...

[greekhoop.livejournal.com]

...how much attention are you going to need before you begin to feel validated? Can you give me a ballpark estimate?

Re: Just to clarify...

[kinneas.livejournal.com]

Yeah, this conversation didn't end days ago.

Re: Just to clarify...

[greekhoop.livejournal.com]

You sure are quick to respond, though.