[ SECRET POST #2061 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2061 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

01.
[Xena: Warrior Princess]


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02.
[tales of symphonia]


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03.
[The Girl From Tomorrow]


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04.
[Spyro the Dragon]


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05.
[Lamento -Beyond the Void-]


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06.
[Aidan Gillen]


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07.
[Skyrim]


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08.
[Touhou Project]


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09.
[Total Recall]


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10.
[Castle]



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11.
[Spyro the Dragon]


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[ ----- SPOILERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]













12. [SPOILERS for the Dark Knight Rises]



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13. [SPOILERS for Digimon 02]



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14. [SPOILERS for the Borgias]



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15. [SPOILERS for Tales of Symphonia]



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16. [SPOILERS for asoiaf/game of thrones]



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17. [SPOILERS for A Dance With Dragons]



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[ ----- TRIGGERY SECRETS AHEAD ----- ]














18. [WARNING for eating disorders]



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19. [WARNING for pedophilia, rape, child abuse]



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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 00 pages, 000 secrets from Secret Submission Post #294.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

The thing is that it's a very basic instinct to defend little children, and that people who admit to reading fictional child porn are gonna get the stink-eye because it's their word (which is in part, "I like to read about sexualized children") against the word of people who predominantly would not ever wish to see a child getting hurt. It's a toss up between the idea of protecting against the idea of someone wanking to questionable stuff, and really now.

The debate here is really unrefined, but people shouldn't ACT surprised when their defense of kiddy porn is taken badly either.

My point is (because I sort of lost track of where i was going) that if the anti-loli/shota people's argument is "NO YOU ARE WRONG" then the kink defenders argument is "NO I'M NOT". You can bring statistics or not, but if you do or not it isn't gonna change shit. You're never gonna have wide approval towards loli/shota.

I'm on camp "Don't fucking tell me. If you do I'm not gonna take it well" which applies to a range of kinks, really. But child porn is probably gonna get a stronger reaction because unlike other types of porn/kinks, it involves children, not adults who are assumed to be able to stand up for themselves.

(and if you ironically shout at me "YOUR ARGUMENT IS JUST 'BUT THINK OF THE CHILDREN'" I'll be like, yeah, and? I'm not using children here as an excuse to further my own opinions. Children are intrinsically involved in this debate, and I'm gonna be thinking of them.)

[(Anonymous)]

Where the hell is my like button graphic?

[(Anonymous)]

applause.gif

[(Anonymous)]

people who admit to reading fictional child porn are gonna get the stink-eye because it's their word (which is in part, "I like to read about sexualized children") against the word of people who predominantly would not ever wish to see a child getting hurt

You say that these are the sides as though people who read fiction about sexualized children DON'T hate seeing children get hurt. I read underage stuff (not visual stuff like loli/shota so I don't know what that's like), and I work with kids. I cannot imagine that the thought of real children being hurt makes anyone else in this thread sicker and angrier than it makes me. Reading fiction and caring about child welfare are not fucking opposite sides in the argument.

[(Anonymous)]

I read underage stuff (not visual stuff like loli/shota so I don't know what that's like), and I work with kids.

Stopped reading right there. Holy shit what's wrong with you. And don't bother answering because it's not a question.

[(Anonymous)]

I know how to differentiate fiction from reality and use my real life to work for things I care about? I guess that's what's wrong with me. :D

[(Anonymous)]

I doubt you're able to help those kids very much if you're too busy jacking off to what happened to them, you sick piece of shit.

[(Anonymous)]

I like how nothing in my comment even implied that, but I guess your self-righteous rage is too strong for reality. Fuck you for implying I would ever do anything like that. And fuck you some more for not even being willing to put your name on a disgusting accusation like that.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, whatever lets you sleep at night. Just hope that your employer doesn't find out about your little hobby.

Also, you may want to stay away from the "you're anonymous" argument when you're not signing your name to anything, either.

[(Anonymous)]

The people I work for know how to distinguish fiction from reality too, but I do appreciate your concern.

I don't want your self-righteous ass following me around forever complaining that there are 15 year olds in my porn. What's your excuse for being anon?

[(Anonymous)]

The people I work for know how to distinguish fiction from reality too

So why don't you just tell them you read stories online about 15-year-olds having sex that may or may not be consensual? I'm sure they'll be all smiles and understanding and may even ask you for recs!

I'm anon because I don't have or want a Dreamwidth account.

[(Anonymous)]

oh you

[(Anonymous)]

+1 lock s/h/it up and throw away the key

[(Anonymous)]

I hate knowing this, but if by reading you mean fanfiction, "underage" is not as bad as loli/shota/visual novels in that sense. The latter hyper-sexualize the children while at the same time aiming for a cutesy/innocent look. "Underage" fanfiction, to its credit, has some sense of normalcy in terms of characterization, tone and setting, and even when it gets into dark/rape territory, it's only the super-fans of anime and similar characterization and writing "styles" who write that kind of skeevy characterization into it, and they kind of give themselves away by it.

[(Anonymous)]

AYRT

Thanks for the info. If I felt like that stuff was all people in this thread were talking about, I probably would have stayed out of it, but I think it's gotten more general now. And I don't want to give fanfiction too much credit because there's a lot of shady stuff that happens in fanfic porn even in purely western fandoms, though the style is different.

[(Anonymous)]

That's what I'm saying. You can say you wouldn't hurt a child or see them hurt, but the part of the sentence that is going to give the strongest impression is "I read underage stuff". For most people, that's enough to be uncomfortable. Are they right? Are you right? I'm really not sure who can decide that. I don't actually doubt that you would never hurt a child, but it doesn't make me any more comfortable about the idea.

[(Anonymous)]

I just don't know why you see the burden of proof the way you do.

No one in this thread has been able to produce evidence that fanwork that depicts kids in sexual situations (which is what I think we're talking about, although the comment above yours makes me unsure) is produced for the purpose of grooming kids or enticing actual predators. Like rape fantasies and 50 Shades of Grey the danger is in not recognizing that real life should not be like fiction. Any tool is a weapon if you hold it right. That doesn't mean you need to side-eye everyone with a toolbox.

[(Anonymous)]

SA

Also, I totally get your "enough to be uncomfortable," because I feel that way about people who support the mainstream porn industry, which is known (some parts more than others) for its shitty treatment of real women. But that discomfort isn't enough to make me assume my friends who watch porn are really coercing women into sex, and I guess that's what sits wrong with me about this thread. There are levels of assumption way beyond discomfort here.

[(Anonymous)]

My argument is that the basic instinct of not wanting to see children as sexualized beings (in fiction or reality)) is going to override the need to defend people's sexual fantasies.

I do think that those saying loli/shota is used to groom children are handling it badly, but I also don't doubt them, and I think they have the right to be worried about that kind of porn. Is that the aim of all fictional kiddy porn? You can't know that unless you produced it, so the people who don't, can't tell. And people see an intrinsic danger in it when the porn involves sexually and mentally undeveloped children. Yes, I agree any tool is a weapon if held right. But you have to consider that you are placing this particular toolbox dangerously over the head of people of an age who cannot defend themselves, and that if it IS turned into a weapon, it's a weapon that's pointed at children. Hence, people are uncomfortable about the possibility.

(Let me be clear that I do not have the intention of downplaying the danger of rape to adults, or that an adult 'should' have the strength to overcome their rape experience NOR that children cannot overcome sexual abuse. I just think it's very clear where the repulsion of fictional child porn comes from)

I'm not gonna discuss whether it should be banned or not; that's a bigger issue that, honestly, no one here can really chew. My whole point is that defending this particular issue or decrying those that are against it is an uphill battle, and a really ugly-looking one at that.

[(Anonymous)]

Thank you for bringing some sanity to this thread. Sheez.

[(Anonymous)]

THIS IS A GOOD COMMENT AND YOU SHOULD FEEL GOOD.

[(Anonymous)]

Societal pressure IS the only way we're going to make a difference, TBH. (As ugly an uphill battle as it may be.) When the tide turns, and enough of us stand up and say, "This is wrong, and no one should be reading/watching it," then the tide will turn, and hopefully the world will be a better and cartoon CP-free place.

[(Anonymous)]

SA

anon above me is right too. Underage could easily just mean teenagers, and people could to be more lenient towards that because lets be honest there is a lot of media centering around the later years of teenagehood. But loli/shota is hyper-sexualized stuff that just does not look good when you're caught reading it.

[(Anonymous)]

In other words: it's all affect heuristic, not logic.

Very few people in this thread are actually using their noggins. They're substituting the question, "does this make me feel bad" for the question "is this wrong." The result is a lack of any remotely intelligent discussion.

(Since I know how this will be taken, I will add the aside: people on both sides are using the heuristic, and people on both sides are substituting).

[(Anonymous)]

+1