fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2363 ]

[ SECRET POST #2363 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2363 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 05 pages, 118 secrets from Secret Submission Post #337.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 1 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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So if the main characters are minors with married parents, the parents can't both be in the story or it's not gen anymore?

There is a difference between mentioning offhandedly that they are married and having actual romantic scenes. If it is the latter, it isn't gen.

Otherwise, what exactly is the purpose of the gen label? We already have genre tags to tell us if a fic is action or drama or romance. If gen isn't to signify that there isn't any romance in the story, what is its use?

I would say that canon pairings being included still counts as gen, but ANY fan pairings are no longer gen, because it's now including your ship opinion in it.

So if I write Harry by himself, but mention his parents being together as they were in the books? Gen. If I write Harry and mention Ginny and Snape having hawt sloppy makeouts in the corner? NOT GEN. I have just gotten some Ginny/Snape action all up in there.

I disagree. If there are romantic scenes, even of canon pairings, it is no longer gen. Canon pairings aren't any more special than fanon pairings. Offhand mentions of fanon pairings would still be gen as well. The issue is when we have romantic scenes between characters, at which point it is no longer a gen fic.

Bit of a bad example, I could see just canon pairings existing being fine. You don't have to explicitly say James and Lily Potter were never together and no one was ever together and everyone hatches out of cabbage patches in an utterly asexual way. But probably no need to do anything focusing on them either.

I think any pairing existing is just fine, even if it is fanon. If, for example, there is an offhand mention of Remus and Sirius being involved but you don't actually see them kissing or going on dates or whatever, then I think that is just as gen as mentioning James and Lily.

By the same token, I think that if you have a scene where James and Lily are on a date, then your fic is no longer gen even though the pairing is canon.

Yeah, but what if you absolutely hate Siris/Remus? If you hate a canon pairing, well, at least it's canon and you can't fuss at the author for including it, but fanon shipping has no need to be included. As soon as you mention it being in there, it's shipping. You're saying "In this fic universe, I ship this" and that's not gen.

The thing is, though, fanfic is fanfic. Fanfic isn't canon. The whole point is speculation, not just rehashing canon. Those differences may be in plot, but they also may be in pairing. So the mention of any pairing is equally shipping. In fanfic, all pairings are on an equal ground.

Fanfic by definition is based on a canon though, to a greater or lesser degree, and in general everything is assumed to align with canon unless stated otherwise.

I mean, imagine reading along a HP fic and then at the very end for no reason the author note says "Oh, btw, I always saw Lily getting together with Remus, not James! So in this Remus was his father."

So no, not all pairings are on equal ground. Harry being Lily and Remus' son instead of James' son is something you would not automatically assume unless stated otherwise.

As long as it is canon and so far in the background it is just a mention sure. Non-canon pairings should not be.

So, let's say there's a show with characters Lisa, Bob, Andrea, Mike, and Karen. On the show, Andrea and Mike are not together. But someone writes a fic where Bob offhandedly mentions that Andrea and Mike ran off together and eloped. Andrea and Mike never appear in the story, and that is the single allusion to their fanon relationship. There are also no romantic interactions between anyone in the fic.

You believe said fic should be labeled Romance?

Why would then even mention that? I wouldn't label it romance. But I'd probably label it that "Multi" thing. Some people hate ships. I don't really mind as long as it isn't a ship I hate, but some people do.

Why is canon any different though? Why is an offhand mention of a pairing that is together in canon any different than a fanon one?

Because some people don't like fanon pairings. I don't like something like....Dean/Lisa. If I was reading a fic, and they mentioned it, it may put me off reading it.

Well, me personally would question why the hell you are mentioning it. Then I would have to scroll through to make sure they are not going to be showing up in the story. Generally, if you mention something like that in a story, it means they are going to be brought back up (like a boring version of Chekov's Gun).

And some people don't like canon pairings. Why does that make a difference?

Because unless you are reading it for a certain fanon pairing, canon pairings are hard to avoid. If Bob and Alice are married in the show, why would they not be married in the fic? Even if the focus is on John, you assume that Alice and Bob are living together. Otherwise, it is an AU story.

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(Anonymous) - 2013-06-22 21:43 (UTC) - Expand

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kaijinscendre - 2013-06-22 21:47 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2013-06-22 21:49 (UTC) - Expand

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kaijinscendre - 2013-06-22 21:59 (UTC) - Expand

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aubry - 2013-06-22 21:55 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2013-06-22 22:10 (UTC) - Expand

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aubry - 2013-06-22 22:22 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2013-06-22 22:28 (UTC) - Expand

na

I overall completely agree with you, but Dean/Lisa is canon and so doesn't count for your argument. :D

If it were, say, Sam/Lisa or Dean/Gabriel being randomly mentioned then yeah, I fully am with you.

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kaijinscendre - 2013-06-22 21:59 (UTC) - Expand

Because people expect canon pairings? Any fanfiction comes with the expectation of canon being mentioned, even the parts of canon you don't like. Random side pairings that come completely out of left field and are entirely the work of the author rather than original canon annoy people.

The level to which it's being taken makes it seem like there's a bunch of people with overly delicate sensibilities running around fandom. But, then again, the use of the word "trigger" kind of demonstrates that.

But why would they automatically expect canon pairings? In fanfic, where anything goes, canon pairings aren't a default. And in fact, in some fandoms, a fanon pairing is expected more to show up than a canon pairing.

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cassandraoftroy - 2013-06-22 22:09 (UTC) - Expand

This whole discussion is kind of making me start to question the point of fanfiction.

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(Anonymous) - 2013-06-23 00:13 (UTC) - Expand

Why not mention it? They don't appear in the story, and the author thinks, "wouldn't it be funny if..." and tosses it in.

I think labeling a case like that under the "multi" thing would be more misleading to a person looking for fics about a fanon pairing than it would be to a person who doesn't want to read about a fanon pairing. And that's really kind of where the disconnect is for me, I suppose. If I'm into Andrea/Mike, then I'm looking for a story that focuses on them, and I'm gonna be pretty damn disappointed if I read an entire fic where nothing actually happens between them.

Because the author likes that pairing and/or dislikes the canon pairing. If you as an author really hate a canon pairing, and the particular characters in question are going to be in your fic, maybe you want to mention that those characters are together. If you don't actually have romantic scenes between them, then why wouldn't that fic be gen?

If you don't actually have romantic scenes between them, then why wouldn't that fic be gen?

Yeah, that's kind of what I'm getting at.

We are actually agreeing, friend.

Then I guess you and other anon can battle it out. I am assuming you are on opposite sides of the debate. I am not a fanfic guru.

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