[ SECRET POST #2595 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2595 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 04 pages, 078 secrets from Secret Submission Post #371.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

Actually, if this video anything to go by, Japan has a different views on LBGT issues, but I wouldn't say they're leagues behind.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxQYu4MOFCY

[(Anonymous)]

I'm actually gay and lived in Japan for years, and dated Japanese women/hung out in Shinjuku Ni-chome. They are definitely behind in that gay marriage is not even something people talk about, let alone a possibility for the near future, and gay people are not open about their sexuality at all. Even the LGBT people who go gay clubbing often use fake names so what they do won't follow them to their "real" lives. The stereotypes are horrendous - gay men are basically not believed to be real by most of society, and seen as either a porn thing or a comedian thing (thanks a lot, "Hard Gay"..), and is often seen as identical with transgenderism/cross-dressing. Despite all the BL stuff (which, to be fair, you can find in any bookstore) it's not seen as real. I was told several times that there were no gay people in Japan when I mentioned my sexuality.

It just doesn't have a religious basis. Gay isn't seen as a sin, it's just seen as non-traditional (which is exactly the problem). There have been hate crimes, but they are relatively low - gay people are just simply ignored. LGBT issues are rarely spoken about. There are gay clubs (a lot of them!) and even a Pride Parade, but unfortunately that's not indicative of a random Japanese person's idea of what being gay means.

So I would say because it's ignored and there's no religious persecution, a lot of things aren't as bad. But there's also zero progress, and not even the regulars of Ni-chome see gay marriage coming anytime soon.

[(Anonymous)]

So if someone tells their friends/coworkers that he is gay, would they think that he's disgusting/sick or would they just think that he's a weirdo?

NAYRT

[(Anonymous)]

Probably both; on the other hand they'd be less likely to harass him or get violent over it.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not Japanese myself, but from my experience (and talking with gay Japanese people) I don't think most people would say it's disgusting or sick, but some might say or think that. I'd say it would mostly just be an awkward conversation, but it wouldn't necessarily damn you socially - unless your office or family finds out, which could be a disaster. I would suggest that younger people tend to be more open minded though, and probably care less.

In my experience, it was "okay" for me to be a lesbian because I am a foreigner. Especially as a Westerner (we're seen as more direct and honest, even to a fault). However, I will say that I feel I did lose one Japanese female friend when I told her I was gay - I can't prove it, but we used to hang out almost every week, and after I told her, she was suddenly busy and I never saw her again. Who knows.

[(Anonymous)]

Asian leaders are not bothered by Putin's anti-gay stance because they agree with it. In Asian societies, GLIBTQ individuals are not shunned or stigmatised on religious grounds as they are in Western societies, but only so long as they know their place. And that place is closeted: out of sight, out of mind, out of hearing and (as Putin said) away from the children.

Asian societies are watching horrified at the increasingly "strident" gay rights movement in the West and committed to rejecting that model in their own countries. And don't even start thinking about gay marriage.

[applemagpie]

I think you've summed up LGBT issues in Japan well. They're certainly not non-existent (for example, there was a LGBT club at a university I attended in Japan), but the common concepts of homosexuality and being transgender are really not the same in Japan as they are in the West.
(I mean, I'm sure it's no great secret to anyone in Japan that there's gay sex in the Tale of Genji, which is taught in Japanese schools. But that also has nothing to do with being accepting of homosexuality)

So when Isayama mentions that his characters' genders don't matter, I don't think he's conflating anything of what he's saying with LGBT issues.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm sure it's no great secret to anyone in Japan that there's gay sex in the Tale of Genji, which is taught in Japanese schools. But that also has nothing to do with being accepting of homosexuality

The same for all the anime and manga that have canon gay characters. It's great that Haruka and Michiru gave a lot of girls positive lesbian role models, but they weren't a statement about Japan's acceptance of homosexuality like Western fandom still sometimes thinks. (And they weren't really even open to other people in the series about their relationship.)

[(Anonymous)]

As far as I can see, most canon gay characters in non-BL/GL manga and anime are humorous stereotypes. And while I love BL and GL, it truly is not representative of Japan's views of homosexuality. Who knows, maybe it is helping some people be more open minded, but then again, being a BL fangirl is also something you keep in the closet, so.

[(Anonymous)]

I have just started reading Tale of Genji, and while there is gay sex in it, it's only (so far) between an adult man (Genji himself) and a boy who hero worships him and also happens to be his servant. All Genji's other relationships are also of the doomed, forbidden sort (married women etc).

If one of the few mainstream representations of gay relationships in Japan is Tale of Genji... No wonder being out and gay is not taken seriously as a normal, boring life option.

[applemagpie]

Haha, yes, that's pretty all of the gay sex there is in the Tale of Genji.
I didn't mean to state that people in Japan are taking the Tale of Genji as the representation of what a gay relationship is. I just brought it up to illustrate how homosexuality doesn't have the same 'sinful' and 'corrupting' connotations in Japan that it has in the West. I doubt there would be any way a book with gay sex in it would be freely allowed to be taught in high schools in say, the United States. Parents and religious groups would have got it banned.

[(Anonymous)]

"Japan is still leagues behind the West in terms of gender equality" (...)
"They are definitely behind in that gay marriage is not even something people talk about, let alone a possibility for the near future, and gay people are not open about their sexuality at all."

You do realize many West countries are the same, right?

[(Anonymous)]

How many countries considered Western (with understanding that this definition is disputed, but I'd say most of Europe, USA, Canada, Australia) aren't openly having a dialogue about LGBT issues, if not considering gay marriage (or other steps toward equality)? I agree that some communities within many western countries are very closed, but overall, I don't see the comparison to Japan as fair. Overall, LGBT issues are being discussed in the West, and they are not in Japan (and most other Asian countries).

[(Anonymous)]

Every country have different issues and I'm not saying others countries are just like Japan, but many "western" countries do their best to ignore the LGBT community, there's enough hate that many people hide their sexuality and if gay marriage is considered at all, the possibility is shut down ASAP.
So saying "Japan is behind (in LGBT issues), the Western world isn't" is... not exactly realistic.

But never mind, sometimes I forget the political/geographic PoV when talking about the world depends on the subject and this time, it's obvious you don't mean "Western countries" in geographical way, so obviously the list of countries is smaller that what I was thinking about.

Still, is worth to remember that in barely twenty-something countries gay marriage is legal and the number of countries that accept same-sex legal unions is around the same number, yet the world has almost 200 countries...

[(Anonymous)]

stop being such a blinded weeaboo