fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2598 ]

[ SECRET POST #2598 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2598 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 031 secrets from Secret Submission Post #371.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

More or less this.

I love when people complain that Disney doesn't have enough POC princesses and then use movies from THE THIRTIES (Snow White) and FIFTIES (Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty) as examples. There are no princesses after that until 1989 (Little Mermaid).

Well no shit! HAVE YOU LOOKED AT ALL MEDIA FROM THE THIRTIES AND FIFTIES?

Post 1989 Disney is pretty fucking inclusive! The 90s fucks shit up, but it's trying! Post-2000 is damn near progressive! IT'S ALMOST AS IF THESE FILMS EXIST IN AN HISTORICAL CONTEXT

HISTORICAL CONTEXT IS FOR SISSIES.

To be serious, I've heard people are upset about lack of non-white characters in Frozen. So at least that's an updated argument?

I loved the Sami wank on tumblr. Especially since an actual Sami reacted to it and said: "hey, please stop confusing us with the Inuit", after which hell broke loose again, and the Sami were now turned into white oppressors.

They are? Because I'm still seeing "Sami are oppressed not-white people". I don't know much about the argument or the Sami people so I mostly stay out of it.

But what you say sounds interesting. Mind telling me more?

Things like this: http://safelystupid.tumblr.com/post/73546168750/the-unpopular-opinions-i-really-wish

You tricked me with the puppies. At first I was like "Puppies!" and then I got sad.

Wait... how is that what they got from what that Sami person said? She just said the Sami are white and people need to stop speaking for them/over them and they... I...

My head hurts.

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kallanda_lee - 2014-02-13 02:01 (UTC) - Expand

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http://www.dumbingofage.com/2013/comic/book-3/02-guess-whos-coming-to-galassos/proven/

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(Anonymous) - 2014-02-13 05:04 (UTC) - Expand

Good point. While it's still very white, post 1989 Disney has given us a lot of different colors and cultures of people. Arabic, Native American, Hawaiian, Black, Asian, and brown-with-white-hair-and-blue-eyes-so-who-knows? characters.

How's it still very though? here is a list of Disney animated movies since 1990:

Rescuers Down Under - Animals (some white people)
Beauty and the Beast - White ppl
Aladdin - No white ppl
Lion King - Animals
Pocahontas - Mixed (not white Princess)
Hunchback of Notre Dame - Mixed (not white Princess)
Hercules - Uuuh what's today's verdict on racially classifying Greeks?
Mulan - No white ppl
Tarzan - White ppl
Fantasia 2000 - No idea
Dinosaur - Animals
Emperor's New Groove - No white ppl
Atlantis - Mixed (not white Princess)
Lilo & Stitch - No white ppl (maybe a couple but only side characters)
Treasure Planet - White ppl
Brother Bear - No White ppl
Home on the Range - Animals
Chicken Little - Animals
Meet the Robinsons - White ppl
Bolt - White ppl
Princess and the Frog - No white ppl as main characters (one secondary character)
Tangled - White ppl
Winnie the Pooh - Animals (some white ppl)
Wreck it Ralph - White ppl
Frozen - White ppl (unless we take ethnicity into account)

I know it's a crude way to put it but what I get from this is that Disney actually has a really good mix of "races". And, to be fair, there was NO white Princess between Belle (1991) and Rapunzel (2010), that's almost 20 years during which Disney was constantly criticized for only having white Princesses but actually having none...

I was thinking that, too. I honestly feel that a lot of SJWs who talk about "POC" are only referring to black people. Disney has actually done a lot of non-European culture stuff. Could they do more? Absolutely. But Disney is not as whitewashed as the critics claim...

"POC" means "African American", they just don't dare to say it like this because it would be racist. It's very frustrating, not least because it is very US-centric and ignores things such as ethnicity which are hugely important everywhere else. Skin color isn't the be all and end all of diversity.

The Tumblr Medieval POC has made several posts about how she gets specifically anti-black abuse, and nothing about her actual background. (Native American.)

Yeah, it's like all those fuckers shitting all over Shirley Temple because she was in some racist movies IN THE FUCKING 30S when she was A FUCKING CHILD. Have these fuckers even goddamn seen any 30s movies? Goddamn everything was racist back then, of course she didn't know any fucking better.

Well fuck honey. You have me lolling.

D: There are actually people in the world who don't like Shirley Temple?

Oooohhhh yeah. Of course they didn't care when she was alive, but when she died there was a wave of horrible SJW hate that shit all over her because she did blackface when she was about three fucking years old.

Apparently she was supposed to apologise for this and spend the rest of her life flogging herself for it. And, no, being the ambassador to Ghana isn't good enough.

Here's some examples if you want to depress yourself.

Oof. Why did I click on that?

Ugh, this is depressing :/ People are morons.

yes, me, but because I found her cloying as all fuck. I agree with the previous poster that you can't blame a little kid for being told to do racist crap in the 30s when racist crap was considered somewhat acceptable and she was much too young to know better.

I'm not excusing Disney, though--the Disney corporation isn't a child actress. I'm just saying that OF COURSE old movies are going to be either racist or not inclusive, and OF COURSE it's going to take time to balance that out.

People who argue that fantasy movies shouldn't have people of color in them because "historical accuracy" are idiots, but so are people who think any movie with white characters is meant as a personal affront to them and the imaginary little girls they wish were offended.

BUT WHY WASN'T SNOW WHITE A BLACK PRINCESS??????

Can I complain there's not enough merch with the non-white characters/princesses? Even when Mulan had just come out it was darn near impossible to find anything of her without the makeup she wears for five minutes then dramatically scrubs off while singing that it's not who she is.

http://static.ddmcdn.com/gif/how-disney-princess-works-16.jpg
http://www.fasthorseinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/princess-bandages.jpg
http://s7d9.scene7.com/is/image/BedBathandBeyond/16027017868560p?$478$
http://img2.targetimg2.com/wcsstore/TargetSAS//img/p/14/36/14360440_130114143000.jpg
http://www.toysrus.com/graphics/product_images/pTRU1-17010577dt.jpg
http://www.ariokano.com/inspiring-disney-princess-school-backpack-pink-bag/
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BXfIZvG4Ofk/URtfP8wXvaI/AAAAAAAAADY/rItl2BlnPpo/s1600/disney+bed.jpg

Most of the choices are "Group shot of entire line" and "Selection of 3-4 of the white princesses" When Princess and the Frog first came out, Tiana got to be in the 3-4 for a while, then came Tangled and she's back to being Second String.

You can totally complain about that, it's shitty.

But I'd probably then complain that we shouldn't be complaining about merch because it's MERCH, I'm not going to lobby a goddamn corporation to sell me more princess crap, and then I'd wave my fists around and make a fool of myself about this side issue.

Yeah. It's just one of those where people love to bring out statistics and numbers and "But they have plenty of..." When the public consciousness is that the stuff Disney's spending all their marketing on and that they see everywhere is the biggest most important part. It's like arguing that Buzz Buzz the Bee is just as important as Mickey Mouse when people aren't going to the parks to buy bee costumes.

Yes, but: isn't the demographic watching the shows much larger than the demographic buying a lot of merch or going to the park? Is the park--where only people of certain means can go--really that important in the first place?

If we're going to worry about girls writ large, should we really bother focusing on girls whose parents can take them to very expensive theme parks? Is the kid with a pile of princess merch the one who's really at risk?