fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #3975 ]

[ SECRET POST #3975 ]

⌈ Secret Post #3975 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 30 secrets from Secret Submission Post #569.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 0 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

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With all due respect, like... I don't have a problem with that kind of ship in general. Because, who cares, and whatever, and I think 90% of the time, the reason people ship things is because of the chemistry and nothing else.

But if you keep shipping that over and over again, that gets a lot closer to the point where it does feel like maybe something there's something about the specific dynamic that appeals to you? And maybe something that could be problematic? I'm sorry, I don't mean to be rude here, but I do think there's a point where it gets a little hinkey. It feels at least a little weird if you consistently love the idea of gay characters not being gay.

No.

Maybe, as a bi person, they love the idea of characters being bi. Just a thought.

That's fair, although it's not really the way that it came across in the secret to me.

Okay but there's ten million straight ones and only a handful of gay ones. Can you not see how that's uncomfortable to people like me who ARE gay? My default is "everyone is bi." With the exception of "UNLESS THEY'RE EXPLICITLY GAY." Because my sexuality (gay girl) is erased often enough and made into something for men to fap to. So yeah, I'm sorry, but this is uncomfortable as all hell.

This, thank you. I'm bi, I would love to see more bi characters in media, but if a character is canonically stated to be gay then they're gay. There are tons and tons of characters out there who are never stated to be one or the other for you to play with, you don't need to mess around with the few characters who are explicitly gay in canon.

There are tons and tons of characters out there who are never stated to be one or the other for you to play with, you don't need to mess around with the few characters who are explicitly gay in canon.

Not sure about OP, but I don't "play with" any characters? (And am not sure what you mean by that, honestly.) It's not like I ever intentionally set out to ship a gay character with somebody of the opposite sex, it just sort of sneaks up on me, like all ships do, and once it does, it's not like I can just decide to stop shipping it. I mean, I can pretend I don't so I don't get yelled at, and not tell anyone about it, but I still ship it.

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(Anonymous) - 2017-11-22 18:00 (UTC) - Expand

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(Anonymous) - 2017-11-23 01:03 (UTC) - Expand

Yeah, I get all of this logically, and yet people writing canonically gay characters in a relationship with the opposite sex really squicks me. I'd never go after an author or anything, but I can't deny it's a visceral reaction for me. Probably from seeing too many canon "lesbian" character who just need the right man.

Being squicked is one thing. We all have things that squick us out. But telling people they need to their shipping preferences for possible ~problematicness~ is just obnoxious.

SA

*examine their shipping preferences

Yeah, I would never ever tell someone they can't ship something but I do still cringe a bit when I see a canon gay character in a straight relationship. And yeah, sure, that's hypocritical since I made everyone gay but eh. I'm not too bothered about this double standard, haha.

NA

This is me, 100%. Well, okay, I don't make everyone gay. But it's me at least 80%, lol.

I judge it because there's already an overwhelmingly large number of canonically heterosexual characters so it's not like there's some sort of shortage of het ships out there to choose from when it comes to shipping. I judge less when people want to ship straight characters in same-sex ships because it's a lot harder to find well-written canon gay pairings, so sometimes (actually a lot of times) shipping two straight characters together is your only option if you're looking for a gay ship in a canon.

It feels at least a little weird if you consistently love the idea of gay characters not being gay.

I'm not sure I like this wording... it's probably not intentional, but it sounds like the people who tell bisexual people in straight-passing relationships that they can't use the queer label because they're 'straight at the moment'.

Yup, but I've noticed it's a pretty common sentiment in the "HDU ship a gay person with a member of the opposite sex" club.

Gay erasure is no bueno, but bi erasure? Just fine. In fact, should be encouraged. Yeeeeeeeah... There actually is a "B" in that acronym, ladies and gents.

/bisexual who's more than a little bitter

But if a character is canonically gay, they aren't bi, so what "erasure" are you talking about here?

I'm a lesbian, and I'm not cool with bi erasure. For instance, I've called out my lesbian friends who referred to Korra and Asami as lesbians when they're canonically bisexual. I would never write a fic where I make a canon bi character gay, and, as a matter of fact, I actually headcanon more characters as bisexual than gay.

That said, I'm a lesbian, so I'm more excited by lesbian representation than bisexual representation. I don't believe this makes me biphobic. I think most people are like this. They are most excited by seeing things that represent them, so I understand why bisexual people are more excited by bi rep than gay rep.

I'm equally as unimpressed by lesbians who erase bi characters' bisexuality and refer to them as "lesbians" and then get angry when bi people do the reverse as I am unimpressed by bi people who erase lesbian characters' lesbianism and refer to them as "bi" and then get angry when lesbians do the reverse.

But yeah, erasing canon lesbian characters and making them bi makes me uncomfortable, so I wouldn't erase a character's bisexuality. Treat people the way you want to be treated and all that yada yada.

Also: I think it's fine for bi and gay people to headcanon straight characters as either bi or gay, and it's definitely not bi erasure, imo. Headcanons aren't representation, and I think it's slightly cruel to tell gay people that they're only allowed to headcanon canon straight characters are bi when 99% of characters are het and MANY gay people have been in heterosexual relationships before realizing that they're gay.

Wild applause. Thank you.

Your comment makes no sense, and you're definitely reaching. Bi people are bisexual. They aren't gay.

Bi people are bisexual, but it is amazing how they are automatically lumped in as hetero when in a hetero relationship, and automatically assumed to be gay when in a same-sex relationship.

weird how this thread wasn't at all about that then

No one is saying that.

A canon gay character is not a canon bi character. People are expressing their discomfort AS GAY PEOPLE at their sexualities being erased because they're gay. Especially when there's maybe a handful of gay characters as it is.

But if you keep shipping that over and over again

The OP said it's the third pairing of that kind, which isn't exactly a lot? I mean, I guess if they're brand new to fandom and shipping and three is a large percentage of them, then I suppose it is. But if they're anything like I would say probably most people here, they've shipped a ton of things, and three isn't really that many.

On the other hand, there's still a somewhat limited number of shippy/fandom shows that have canonically gay characters to start with, so you don't know how often the situation arises.

I suppose that's true, although I'm not sure what you mean by "shippy/fandom" shows? If you'd said there aren't many shows that have gay characters, period, fair enough. But if you mean "of shows that have fandoms" I'm not sure that that matters? There are plenty of shows I watch that don't have fandoms (when I go looking for fic, there's not any; there's no art; there's no fannish discussion online, etc.) but I still ship things from them. (Although maybe most people don't, who knows?)

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