fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #4953 ]

Oh, I missed out on some
t o p
t i e r
d r a m a.

Y'all can get this pressed over a piece of media that you probably weren't going to interact much with anyway since it's a spinoff???

The original story is still there, right? Just draw a line between that and whatever the hell this Boruto shit is.

This is why the Japanese fandom has and always will be superior.

Imagine people actually understood this simple fandom rule, there'd be no drama lmao

How pressed can you get over the idea of people not liking your ship? Not liking your ship is not a personal attack.

People liking your NOTP is also not a personal attack.

People calling you a delusional pearlclutcher for having NOTP in the first place, however, is very much a personal attack.

It's literally not but go off.

Do you know what the definition of a personal attack is? Because I'm pretty sure that "pearlclutcher" is a personal insult.

Soooo insulting.

If you disrespect someone, you don't get to cry in a corner about how sad you feel over being disrespected in fandom.

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 13:33 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 13:35 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 13:35 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 13:44 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 13:46 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 13:56 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 14:19 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 14:20 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 14:28 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 15:06 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 15:14 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 15:41 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 14:21 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-29 14:24 (UTC) - Expand

OP is still around. I admit I didn't realize I would wad up so may panties with my secret lol, but this whole thread is EXACTLY the type of baboon shit flinging I was referencing in said secret, so I was proved right twice over!

This is why the Japanese fandom has and always will be superior.

Japanese fandom has a healthier outlook on fiction for the most part. Don't get me wrong, in my experience Japanese fangirls can be just as vicious in fighting over petty bullcrap (another Japanese fandom I'm in had a literal comiket-ending fight between two factions of people who shipped the same slash pairing, but if you shipped A/B the B/A'ers wanted to fight you IRL basically lol, and they succeeded in getting a bunch of A/B doujinka kicked out of a series specific comiket), but for the most part Japanese fandom understands the difference between "this dynamic is kind of cute in fiction" and "oh look a literal IRL child groomer".

Like I said to someone else, we're talking about a goddamn fluffy dog demon in a pretty human disguse. He's not even """human""". They're able to take it on face value and go "oh, cute", without it being some giant fucking IRL social statement.

> Japanese fandom has a healthier outlook on fiction for the most part

It also has a lot more people getting their rocks off to literal children, but go off, I guess.

The casual racism, but go off I guess.

Pointing out that the country you consider superior to others has the same flaws as other countries is not racism, sorry.

You know that Rin is fictional and therefore not "literal", right?

You know, the way you keep trying to paint everyone who doesn't like your ship as screeching harpy antis doesn't really reflect well on you or your ability to take valid criticism. You can't stand there and demand everyone accept your ship and then turn around and whine at everyone who DOESN'T like it. Either you get acceptance and have to extend the same courtesy to others or you don't accept others may not share your preference, in which case you don't get to complain about it either.

The pot calling the kettle black is all over this thread and I'm living for it.

In both directions, even.

It's really surreal to watch.

The "criticism" I've seen so far is "lowkey this enables grooming IRL and you should be ashamed for liking it", which certainly ain't valid criticism in my book lol. The only other "criticism" has been "okay, you can ship it, BUT I'm going to spend paragraphs telling you just how disgusting and gross and horrible I think this pairing is".

I don't need people to "accept" my ship, they can not like it all they want, and in face a couple anons at the beginning were able to say they're not into it at all without clutching basketball sized pearls over it.

The only thing I want is to stop pretending that shipping this is some big social statement on real life, stop pretending it has ANYTHING to do with real life. It's a bad look, and it's very typical of the anti-mindset where people can't separate reality from fiction.

Hell, I LOVE to play Mortal Kombat. I love ripping out guts and tearing off heads and disemboweling people in the game. I specifically enjoy how gory and over the top the game is. Does that make me an IRL serial killer now because I don't preface each time I say I like the game with "I know killing is evil and wrong IRL and I'm such a bad person for enjoying this, I'm sorry, I'm so sorry"?

The game is specifically promoting and glorifying said violence and gore. And yet somehow, we don't have an epidemic of dudes screaming "FATALITY" and ripping people's heads off on the subway. Because it's fiction, it's escapist, it's not real, it's not dangerous, and it's not hurting anybody.

"lowkey this enables grooming IRL and you should be ashamed for liking it"

Where did you see that in this thread? Seriously, where do you keep seeing all these comments outside of your own mind?

"okay, you can ship it, BUT I'm going to spend paragraphs telling you just how disgusting and gross and horrible I think this pairing is".

What's wrong with that? Is there a rule stating that only positive opinions about ships are allowed on fandomsecrets?

I don't need people to "accept" my ship, they can not like it all they want, and in face a couple anons at the beginning were able to say they're not into it at all without clutching basketball sized pearls over it.

I was one of them. Up until I got called a pearclutcher for saying this.

The only thing I want is to stop pretending that shipping this is some big social statement on real life, stop pretending it has ANYTHING to do with real life.

A romantic relationship between an adult and a child is still a pedophiliac relationship, sorry. In the same way that a ship between two characters of the same sex isn't a queer ship and a relationship between characters related to each other is an incest ship. It's ok to like any and every of these ships, but it's just as ridiculus to insist that adult Sess crushing on prepub Ris isn't "really" grooming as it would be to insist that a gay ship is somehow actually straight.

Hell, I LOVE to play Mortal Kombat. I love ripping out guts and tearing off heads and disemboweling people in the game.

Do you also often say "I disagree that the game has violence and gore, I just don't see it a violence and gore. It has aliens, and anyway it's ok in their culture, so we shouldn't use the words like violence when describing it"?

Where did you see that in this thread? Seriously, where do you keep seeing all these comments outside of your own mind?

There's literally someone upthread saying that SessRin could be responsible for an IRL grooming of a child.

What's wrong with that? Is there a rule stating that only positive opinions about ships are allowed on fandomsecrets?

Except this isn't "ship and let ship" then, or "YKINMKATO", it's "I can't stop you from liking this ship but I'm going to try my hardest to make sure you have a fucking hard time shipping it in peace".

I was one of them. Up until I got called a pearclutcher for saying this.

No, you very specifically were not lol.

A romantic relationship between an adult and a child is still a pedophiliac relationship, sorry. In the same way that a ship between two characters of the same sex isn't a queer ship and a relationship between characters related to each other is an incest ship. It's ok to like any and every of these ships, but it's just as ridiculus to insist that adult Sess crushing on prepub Ris isn't "really" grooming as it would be to insist that a gay ship is somehow actually straight.

Except I'm pretty sure it's meant to not happen until she's an adult? I'm seriously confused on this part, because I'm not sure what would make antis happy regarding this ship, beyond it just not existing at all. What would Sesshoumaru have to do or not do to make it "okay" to get together with an adult Rin?

I guess I'm just so confused because these are all literal hundreds and hundreds of year old demons. Every single relationship in this series should be problematic. Inu-Yasha and Kagome, she's fifteen years old, only three years older than Rin, and Inu-yasha has hundreds of years and a whole tragic past love story on her. He's lived several human lifetimes by this point, they all have. I don't think they view things the same way. Rin is going to be gone in the blink of Sesshoumaru's eye lifespan wise, and yet he's not trying to advance on her as a child, he's akwardly trying to make her like him, and to convey that he has feelings for her as a person, that she isn't just "yes hello child I can't seem to get rid of". I don't know if you've read his proposal or not, but to me it seems to be him trying to show he does listen to her, and wants to make sure she's safe and happy and that she can always call on him if she needs him.

It all seems incredibly benign to me. Yes, there is very slight subtext, but it's very minor, and I guess I just view the demons as less...human like that a lot of other fans are. I always thought a huge part of their schtick was how inhuman they are, how they're living immortal or near-immortal lifetimes and how human affairs seem insignificant to most of them, and part of Sesshoumaru's whole thing was being destined to fall into his father's footsteps despite how much he hated the idea in theory.

Do you also often say "I disagree that the game has violence and gore, I just don't see it a violence and gore. It has aliens, and anyway it's ok in their culture, so we shouldn't use the words like violence when describing it"?

I say that it's definitely nonchalant and very much normalized in said game, much like I'm saying "literal dog demon has subtle hints towards future consensual romance with human girl" is being treated as nonchalant within the context of this narrative, and I'm sorry I don't think that's the end of the world and it doesn't deserve pages upon pages of fucking pedo/grooming discourse? I would't sit and say "omg this game has violence and gore and how irresponsible of it to portray it so casually, they need to treat this with the gravity it deserves and make sure we understand how disgusting this is IRL", much like I'm saying I think it's ridiculous to go "I know it's grooming/pedo and we need to make sure to say how gross and nasty it is uwu" every time someone brings up Sess x adult!Rin in a consensual relationship.

There's literally someone upthread saying that SessRin could be responsible for an IRL grooming of a child.

Then go argue with that one eprson, not with everyone who tells you they're cool with the ship, just not with the denials and excuses you're weaving around it.

Except this isn't "ship and let ship" then, or "YKINMKATO", it's "I can't stop you from liking this ship but I'm going to try my hardest to make sure you have a fucking hard time shipping it in peace".

YKINMKATO has never meant "it's not really a kink, sicne it's fiction and all, it's completely vanilla obviously and everyone who says otherwise is a dirty disgusting anti!"

No, you very specifically were not lol.

I'm the one who made that comment with a bunch of +1s that congratulated you on getting your ship canonized. And then you just couldn't resist the urge to tell me that my own feelings about the ship are invalid, because you just personally don't see it as grooming uwu.

Except I'm pretty sure it's meant to not happen until she's an adult?

That's not what you and the other shippers said, though. You said that you see him as having romantic feelings and making romantic gestures towards her since she was a child, and people who don't ship it are delusional for not seeing them as romantic gestures, eg. bringing her the kimono. Either he made no move on her until she was an adult, or he's been grooming her since her childhood. have you changed your mind about this?

I'm seriously confused on this part, because I'm not sure what would make antis happy regarding this ship, beyond it just not existing at all. What would Sesshoumaru have to do or not do to make it "okay" to get together with an adult Rin?

By "okay" you mean "having no problematic elements", not "okay to ship" which I have repeatedly stated is already ok to do?

If it's the former, then what would make it okay is if he'd dropped her off at the human village when she was 12, and then never visited her again until she was an adult. That's what would've made me happy, though I'm sure there are some who would still find their relationship skeevy, and they have a right. But as it is - and as you personally said you see this as - he's been courting her since an early age.

I guess I'm just so confused because these are all literal hundreds and hundreds of year old demons. Every single relationship in this series should be problematic.

And to some, it might be the case, and they have a right to find these relationships uncomfortable. I've seen people finding the relationship between Bella and Edward from Twilight uncomfortable for this reason. I respect their opinion, even if I don't personally share it. I do, however, share the opinion of people who find a romantic relationship between someone with the body and mind of and adult and a literal prepubescent human child to be a dealbreaker.

I don't know if you've read his proposal or not, but to me it seems to be him trying to show he does listen to her, and wants to make sure she's safe and happy and that she can always call on him if she needs him.

"I want you to feel safe and happy while we bang." is sweet and all, but I fail to see how it changes anything about the fact that he's telling this to a child that he's groomed since a very young age.

Yes, there is very slight subtext, but it's very minor, and I guess I just view the demons as less...human like that a lot of other fans are. I always thought a huge part of their schtick was how inhuman they are, how they're living immortal or near-immortal lifetimes and how human affairs seem insignificant to most of them

That reminds me of how I used to be a teen and shipping Sandcest in Naruto. I also used to say "But Gaara knows very little about what a normal family life is supposed to look like, so he doesn't really know that banging his sister is inappropriate". Cool motive, still incest.

would't sit and say "omg this game has violence and gore and how irresponsible of it to portray it so casually, they need to treat this with the gravity it deserves and make sure we understand how disgusting this is IRL",

Good thing I've never said that about the grooming. Literally all I'm arguing is to stop pretending it isn't grooming.

YKINMKATO has never meant "it's not really a kink, sicne it's fiction and all, it's completely vanilla obviously and everyone who says otherwise is a dirty disgusting anti!"

Lol please. YKINMYATO doesn't mean "I'm going to interrogate how you ship this and DEMAND you bow before my interpretation of it" either. I think you're full of shit, why would I subscribe to your theory of things?

I'm the one who made that comment with a bunch of +1s that congratulated you on getting your ship canonized. And then you just couldn't resist the urge to tell me that my own feelings about the ship are invalid, because you just personally don't see it as grooming uwu.

Yeah, I know that was you, and my point stands. "Congrats on getting it canonized OP, but you do know it's dirtybaddisgusting wrong right? SAY IT'S DIRTYBADWRONG OP." is the kind of """support""" I do not want or need thank you very much.

That's not what you and the other shippers said, though. You said that you see him as having romantic feelings and making romantic gestures towards her since she was a child, and people who don't ship it are delusional for not seeing them as romantic gestures, eg. bringing her the kimono. Either he made no move on her until she was an adult, or he's been grooming her since her childhood. have you changed your mind about this?

I said people who view him as having fatherly feelings towards her are delusional. He's barely grown himself.

Also, no I haven't changed my mind about this, I just don't think giving kimono fabric and trinkets and visiting her is fucking grooming anon.

If it's the former, then what would make it okay is if he'd dropped her off at the human village when she was 12, and then never visited her again until she was an adult. That's what would've made me happy, though I'm sure there are some who would still find their relationship skeevy, and they have a right. But as it is - and as you personally said you see this as - he's been courting her since an early age.

Oh my fucking god. Just admit you hate the ship period and this really doesn't have anything to do with how he acts in the canon lol. "The only thing that would make it okay is if he never set eyes on her or even thought about her and abandoned her entirely until she hit 18."

Yeah, I don't see that happening and you don't either, but the idea that he would completely abandon and have nothing to do with her--surely devastating Rin--until she's an adult is honestly way fucking creepier to me, and seems a hell of a lot more like grooming than what happened in canon. "Sorry Rin, I need Kaede to raise you until you're of Prime Banging Age, I'll now abandon you completely until your womb is tended and fertile and your hips are round, peace out."

"I want you to feel safe and happy while we bang." is sweet and all, but I fail to see how it changes anything about the fact that he's telling this to a child that he's groomed since a very young age.

You DO know what grooming is, right? I mean I sure do, I had it happen to me IRL, and it looked a lot more like a sweaty 40 year old man furtively feeling up my junk than getting awkward proposals from demon lords who haven't laid a single finger on me. If you think he's trying to say "I want you to feel safe and happy while we bang" I think you're either extremely ignorant regarding Japanese subtext, or you're deliberately reading it in the way that will piss you off the most. There is zero sexual connotation to what he's saying, he's trying to prove to Rin he sees her as an actual person, and that has has been listening and seeing her, he doesn't view her as an expendable human he has no emotions for. That's why he mentions the bullying and that if she needs him, he'll come to her. He's trying to prove he cares about her and would help her. The whole situation is meant to be a subversion, since Sesshoumaru thought his own father as weak and foolish for sacrificing himself for a human, and now here he is making much the same pledge.

That reminds me of how I used to be a teen and shipping Sandcest in Naruto. I also used to say "But Gaara knows very little about what a normal family life is supposed to look like, so he doesn't really know that banging his sister is inappropriate". Cool motive, still incest.

Okay, so you ship incest. This still isn't grooming. Sesshoumaru is not sexually grooming a child for fuck's sake.

(Also I didn't even know Gaara had a sister. The More You Know I guess.)

Good thing I've never said that about the grooming. Literally all I'm arguing is to stop pretending it isn't grooming.

Except I don't agree with you, and I'll not stop saying what I think. Don't like the ship all you want, but trying to project that Sesshoumaru is a sexual predator because he cares about Rin and doesn't just drop her off and totally abandon her until she's ready to get a hot demon bun dropped in her oven. This is why I'm saying there's basically no way to make antis like you happy. The sheer fact that he knows her at all when she's younger skeeves you all out, and it has basically zero to do with "grooming", this is just a convenient bludgeon to bash shippers over the head with. It's the only way you can think of to try and shame someone for shipping two adults together.

Re: OP

(Anonymous) - 2020-07-30 08:36 (UTC) - Expand

And to some, it might be the case, and they have a right to find these relationships uncomfortable.

To me the difference is a lot of those relationships are... Adults with adults???

Inu-Yasha acts like a shitty teen to Kagome's teenager. Sesshoumaru doesn't act like a 19-year-old and I'd peg him late 20s at the youngest.

Likewise, Izayoi and Inupapa are BOTH ADULTS.

Rin is... eleven as of the end of the series when Kagome finally stays put in the past. Like. There's a marked difference there between them!

I also fine the 600+-year-old loli trope to be bullshit, too! Surprise, surprise!

But OP is clearly a closet pedo with how they're trying to string this together as "NO IT WASN'T GROOMING IT WAS ROMANTIC!!!!!"