[ SECRET POST #2003 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2003 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 02 pages, 040 secrets from Secret Submission Post #286.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

p sure trolling, but...

lol guess i better get my gay guy ass out of the fandoms where guys having sex with guys is the biggest focus and move over to the real gay stuff like het and teen novels, right? :')

not-news newsflash: your experience =/= everyone's experience. not all gay guys = the gay guys you know. fuck you.

[(Anonymous)]

i will never understand why people insist on cursing at each other when their point is made just as well without it. no offense, it just comes off as so childish. and yeah, you're anon, so nobody knows, but you know.

[deenaa]

Saying no offence when you clearly mean offence is more childish, imo.

More on topic, swearing is typically emotional, and the dude above has every right to be pissed with this secret. It's offensive and shallow minded. Don't shame him for being pissed about it. :\

anon new to this thread

[(Anonymous)]

I get what you mean, but I find it very, very difficult to not get emotional in response when people end something with a "fuck you". It's always tacked on and undermines whatever good points they were raising.

I also dislike the "no offense, but..." phrase. And condescending endearments like "honey", "darling", "sweetie", and, ohhh, do I freeze when I see "educate yourself"... and.

Yeah. I don't much respect cursing and condescension in those contexts. I will try to listen anyway, but those things make it more difficult.

Re: anon new to this thread

[(Anonymous)]

DA

oh so we're going with the tone argument, ok!

Maybe don't join big-people arguments if you can't handle some emotion coming into an emotional topic.

We're just so bummed you don't 'respect' us.

Re: anon new to this thread

[(Anonymous)]

There's no need to get like this.

Re: anon new to this thread

[anonymouslyyours]

Don't dismiss what someone is saying because you don't like their tone. You aren't the frickin' recess police. We have a right to express ourselves however we want and still be heard. Especially when other people start by talking shit about us.

Re: anon new to this thread

[(Anonymous)]

I will listen to their arguments, of course. What I'm trying to say is that I find it difficult to be open to what they say when they insist on insulting me, cursing me or being so condescending. If they have the right to express however they want, then surely I have the right not to stand for insults.

Re: anon new to this thread

[anonymouslyyours]

I think you should keep in mind that in this case specifically you're speaking about a minority whose behaviors have been policed for probably most his life. You have the right to get out of any conversation but not to say that someone doesn't have a valid point because they weren't nice about it. You "finding it hard" to listen is your problem not ours. Nothing in your comment addressed the anon's point. You decided to judge what was and was not necessary, attacking something completely irrelevant to what someone was trying to express and therefore dismissed the original point. I personally feel like you were the one being condescending here. Just because someone uses language that you find distasteful doesn't mean you get to ignore them until they meet your "standards".

Re: anon new to this thread

[(Anonymous)]

+128092445

You fucking preach it!

Re: anon new to this thread

[(Anonymous)]

I said nothing about the original anon's message because I agreed with him. It was the "fuck you" and then the response by the next person about "no offense" but that I was talking about, because those things in general are hard not to see them and make you defensive automatically. Getting everyone angry will accomplish nothing, just making more people angry.

And I never said that they don't have valid points nor do they deserve being heard. I'm just pointing out that they seriously diminish the amount of people who will listen when they use that sort of language. Whether they wish to continue or not is their choice.

Fine, I'll never, ever again try to point out things like that, since apparently this kind of thing is taken more seriously and personally than I expected.

You're usually very nice in your comments (you've even responded in a very polite and cordial manner to me, in other occasions; you're one of my favorite commenters here), which makes me it all the more surreal to see you responding to me like this when I wasn't even trying to be confrontational, or erasing, or whatever else I came across like.

Re: anon new to this thread

[anonymouslyyours]

Maybe I was a little defensive but I've seen this attitude and had it directed at me in a very negative way a lot. I'm sorry you were hurt by it. But the people who aren't willing to listen based on language choice don't tend to be the people who would be willing to listen anyway. This felt like the kind of nit-picking that is almost always used as derailment. I've never seen an instance where someone who took issue with superficial word choice actually listened or respected others opinions. If that's not the case here I apologize and hope maybe you can see where I was coming from.

I don't think this is what you meant but, "Getting everyone angry will accomplish nothing, just making more people angry." is difficult to hear because the person who posted the secret got the original anonymous replier angry and it sounds as if you are saying they are not entitled to their feelings or that while the original poster was allowed to vent and act hatefully on their feelings the replier, who feels victimized, isn't and should behave.

Re: anon new to this thread

[(Anonymous)]

I'm sorry too. I probably should have brought it up in the general thread instead, to make it clearer that I meant language in the general sense, not in this specific case. I didn't mean to bring up bad memories, and I think I've seen occurrences of what you mention; but I just dismissed those persons as either trolls or very stubborn people because they often started flinging insults in the same breath, which showed what exactly they were trying to accomplish.

I much, much prefer not cursing irl and online, because I've seen how, unless it's a very friendly environment, it tends to escalate arguments, instead of diffusing them and helping both parties reach an understanding. That's what I was trying to get at in my other comments.

I really should have also mentioned that, if someone has the intention to hurt, or to erase the other person's argument, then a compromise probably wouldn't be reached anyway, but any on-lookers are more likely to listen more attentively to the person that remains calm.

And I'm really not saying that people don't have the right to get angry and curse when they're being attacked, of course not! I'm very, very sorry that I came across like that. That was never what I meant. I really only wanted to point out how remaining calm and polite has more far-reaching success, but of course that we're all only human and cannot be unfailingly polite and unmovable all the time.

This comment got very long. In any case, I hope I'm not sticking my foot in my mouth anymore.

I do think I'll just stop commenting in this kinds of threads like I said before — they're too volatile and I don't tend to word myself well.

Re: anon new to this thread

[fuchsiascreams]

I really don't think that this person is responding to you in a way that is unfair at all. They weren't swearing, they weren't insulting you - they were responding to you with the exact same amount of politeness that you feel like you were responding to the other anon with.

ayrt

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, I was reading into it something that wasn't there. Sorry.

Re: anon new to this thread

[diet_poison]

but not to say that someone doesn't have a valid point because they weren't nice about it.

yeah except no one said that.

Re: anon new to this thread

[diet_poison]

omg you just brought up tone argument

you know how much bullshit that is? NO ONE HERE IS TRYING TO INVALIDATE ANYONE'S POINT BY BRINGING UP THEIR TONE. They're just pointing out that it sometimes makes people difficult to talk to. Which is legit.

[(Anonymous)]

i didn't mean offense, though, which is why i used it. just because you're pointing out something that somebody may not like to hear doesn't mean you actually want to offend them. it's an anon trend here, cursing at people, and i just want this view represented.

so my point is, you could tell he was pissed with everything he wrote, anyway. it's just unnecessary to add a 'fuck you', or any other meaningless slight, and in almost all cases, it makes you look like you can't control yourself and because of that people may be inclined to take your words and emotions less seriously. and when you're upset, that's the last thing that you want to happen.

[(Anonymous)]

I totally agree with you. I was down with the comment until the "fuck you" and now just am like "whatever." Push a button, get a "fuck you."

[(Anonymous)]

I'm not a huge fan of cursing, I don't do it much and I don't write it much. And I tend to find it off-putting in a lot of situations. But, honestly, I completely understand it in this context. It's supposed to convey strong feelings and it does - that's what it's for. Telling someone to watch their language when their really hurt and offended just seems sort of condescending - like, yeah, you can be mad, but only the way I say you can be mad.

[anonymouslyyours]

I feel like you just didn't want to hear his comment so you found a convenient way to dismiss him. Content > tone every single time and I think it's pretty immature not to get that.

[fuchsiascreams]

I agree with you to an extent; for example, I've often seen people dismiss individuals as being stupid or their points as being not worth reading just because they were writing without using grammar, or caps lock, etc., which is a stupid idea; on the other hand, if it gets to the point where you are insulting the other person, then I don't feel like you probably wanted a serious discussion in the first place.

In this case, OP said something that could easily offend a lot of people, and it's not like anon was responding to a rational argument with a "FUCK YOU, YOU PIECE OF SHIT" or anything like that, ffs.

[anonymouslyyours]

I think you're agreeing with me? I'm speaking of a specific comment in which someone clearly had something to say with content and not a generic slur or insult. The vulgar language seemed to be employed to communicate the emotion felt and make a point that wouldn't have quite the impact worded differently.

[fuchsiascreams]

Indeed! I am agreeing with you.

[altuscor.livejournal.com]

Honestly, I really wanted to swear at the person who wrote this secret and give them a huge slap in the face for being offensive, so I totally understand where he's coming from.

I couldn't agree more with what he said. He still raised some good points my opinion. The sentiment in his response is something I can understand completely. It's like if I was told "Real Asians do this because no Asian I know does this other thing and any Asian who does is a liar". Then, as a person of Asian-descent, I'd be insulted. Replace 'Asian' with whatever you identify with and you'd probably be offended too. And call the culprit out on whatever offensive statement they made.

If it was just "fuck you" he wrote, then it's a no-brainer response. Then I'd roll my eyes. But dismissing everything else he said just because you can't get past a few curse words seems like a prissy move. And to be honest, the person who wrote the secret in my opinion deserved a mere "fuck you".