fandomsecrets | [ SECRET POST #2076 ]

[ SECRET POST #2076 ]

⌈ Secret Post #2076 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 5 pages, 108 secrets from Secret Submission Post #297.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 4 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Man... bisexuals really do think they're more persecuted than everybody else, don't they?

Seeing how they get shit from both straight people and gay people about how they're really straight or gay, and they need to figure it out... I can see why.

Yep. It's amazing how threatened people seem by the idea that sexuality isn't entirely black and white.

For some, maybe that's actually the reason. But the comment below yours is more on the mark for what I've actually witnessed.

er, depends on the crowd you're in? Especially with gay crowds. Especially with queer women. Where are you finding queer women who aren't extremely well aware of how not black and white sexuality is?

I can't. To me it seems gay people most get pissed off exactly at those bisexuals that think getting "shit from both straight people and gay people" makes them more oppressed and any objection to that gets called biphobia.

You're not seeing how more people being arses towards you=more oppressed? Did you fail basic maths?

Everything that applies to gays applies to bisexuals, only they also get heterophobia and biphobia thrown into the mix. Again, more stuff=more oppressed. Not hard to figure out. Gays just seem to think that bisexuals aren't affected by homophobia.

Lol, heterophobia.

If a bisexual person marries into a heterosexual relationship any hate they get from a gay community is made null since they are a minority that can easily be ignored in the big picture. Maybe all that basic math you exceeded at did away with your common sense?

Bisexuals are not more opressed than homosexuals. They can at least have a chance at marrying their partner.

OPPRESSION OLYMPICS TIME!

I WIN! Because I have all the privilege and the judges, being part of an institution, are racist and biased!

I accept this gold for all the oppressed white straight males out there! Thank you, thank you all! ONE DAY WE'LL MAKE IT AND SHOW YOU ALL!

Keep stroking that hateboner.

Do you... want to be my kismesis?

If their partner is of the opposite gender. You could move out of your backward-ass country, y'know.

Yeah, I'm sure they could, since it's so easy and cheap and quick to just move to a different country. Why would anyone live in those countries where they don't have basic rights? Man, what a silly anon, that's what they get for choosing to live in a backward-ass country!

We get shit from straights and gays. Every time someone makes fun of someone for having homosexual feelings, it affects us. Every time someone disparages someone for living a heteronormative lifestyle, it applies to us. When someone tries to say sexuality is based in chemistry, that homosexual men are more like women and homosexual women are more like men, they're saying we don't exist. Many people just plain don't believe we can exist or think we're confused.

So, yeah, we kind of do get a lot of crap.

How is the chemistry bit supposed to discount bisexuality?

You're seriously comparing "disparaging of heteronormative lifestyles" with "homophobia"? Woooooow, I hope you aren't.

Wow, Ok, I know this is kind of opening a can of worms, but sorry I gotta say something.

Disparaging someone for having a heterosexual lifestyle is a complete non-problem so counting that as oppression is kinda silly. You'd be part of the majority of the world then, and anything anyone says to you about it can simply be shrugged off as you can now simply go back to a society that has most of it's doors open to you.

I don't see any comments saying bisexuals do NOT get a lot of crap, but if you honestly think any of the stuff you listed compares to what gay people face everywhere, then I'm sorry, but you need some perspective.

Gay people are still face a lot of violence, and you can find many queer women and men that will tell you about how their bisexual partners left them when they couldn't take the heat of homophobia and/or realized that suffering it was something they could opt out of. That alone is enough to tell you that, yes, although bisexuals do get a lot of crap, they are not as oppressed as gay people are.

Homosexuals are just as capable of passing as straight as bisexuals are. This idea that bisexuals can somehow turn off the homosexual aspects of their sexuality or choose to be attracted to someone of the opposite gender in lieu of someone of the same is completely wrong. Anyone can choose to be single or live a lie, that's not somehow exclusive to bisexuals. We may choose to pursue a heterosexual relationship with genuine interest in a person of the opposite sex, but that doesn't mean we don't still suffer from homophobia.

Bisexuals in your example aren't opting out of having homosexual feelings: they're choosing to do what many homosexuals also do, which is pretend to be heterosexual and live a heteronormative lifestyle. That bisexuals feel the need to do so is just proof that they are just as affected by homophobia.

Where do you get this idea that bisexuals who are open about their sexuality don't also face homophobia? You act like a bisexual having to hide their sexuality due to homophobia is somehow vastly different from a homosexual doing the same or that the average person is fully aware that bisexuals aren't homosexuals pretending to be straight.

Homosexuals are just as capable of passing as straight as bisexuals are.

They are only capable of doing that if they're not effeminate men or butch women. But this isn't about passing as heterosexual, It's about living a dignified life in society.

Bisexuals in your example aren't opting out of having homosexual feelings: they're choosing to do what many homosexuals also do, which is pretend to be heterosexual and live a heteronormative lifestyle. That bisexuals feel the need to do so is just proof that they are just as affected by homophobia.

Like you said, bisexuals may choose to pursue a heterosexual relationship with genuine interest in a person of the opposite sex and be happy still, gay people don't have such an option.

Where do you get this idea that bisexuals who are open about their sexuality don't also face homophobia?

I don't think I've ever said bisexuals don't face homophobia...? What I did say is that the people affected the most by it are the ones in relationships with a person of the same sex as theirs.
Someone that has a chance to blend in into society while still having a chance to be happy like that has an advantage above those who don't- Bisexuals have advantages in life that gay people lack, just like a masculine gay man has advantages in life an effeminate gay mack lacks. This isn't something you have to be offended by when someone points it out.

They are only capable of doing that if they're not effeminate men or butch women.

...You...do know that bisexual men can be effeminate and bisexual women can be butch, too, right?

But yeah, the thing is, sure, bisexuals can end up in a happy relationship with someone of the 'opposite' gender* and be fine and dandy and accepted by society. But the thing is, that is at the cost of our identities. Most of us don't want to pretend to be straight, and the assumption that we do is upsetting.

Honestly, as a bisexual woman, I find it pretty goddamn upsetting when people try to tell me that my experiences with homophobia and biphobia are less important than a lesbian's because I could conceivably fall for a man and blend in. No. I am still looked at with disgust by homophobic people who find out my sexuality. Some women still act like they're afraid I'm going to molest them because obviously a girl who likes girls wants to fuck any girl that moves. I still have to worry about things like physical assault and even possibly attempts of corrective rape happening to me if I'm in the wrong place at the wrong time and the wrong person knows I'm attracted to women. It isn't magically easier to be bisexual because I can possibly fall for a man.

Also I can't speak for anyone else, but I think games of Oppression Olympics are fucking dumb and I'd never say it's "harder" to be bisexual than gay. That said, it really fucking hurts to have to be afraid to participate in queer communities because of the [fairly high] chance of me being written off because I "have some straight privilege" or what the fuck ever.

* = I am aware that there are more than two genders. I just couldn't think of a better way to phrase that. So have a disclaimer.

But yeah, the thing is, sure, bisexuals can end up in a happy relationship with someone of the 'opposite' gender* and be fine and dandy and accepted by society. But the thing is, that is at the cost of our identities. Most of us don't want to pretend to be straight, and the assumption that we do is upsetting.

You wouldn't be pretending to be heterosexual in that case, you'd be in a heterosexual relationship, and you'd be happy, that's all. Bisexual people who are in gay relationships aren't pretending to be gay either, but if they choose to stay in a gay relationship they will face more hardships than they would if they were into a hetero one. That chance of blending in while still being relatively happy is something gay people don't have. They either become miserable by denying themselves or they accept themselves at the risk of everyone around them making them miserable. Do you see what I mean?

Hm. But right in my previous post I said that I think bisexual people are also affected by homophobia. Thing is, people in heterosexual relationships are safer from homophobia than people in gay relationships are (unless it's an atypical kind of relationship, but I'm going for something more general here). It's not an attack on you personally when someone points out that you have advantages that they don't. It's like if person A is mixed race and has lighter skin than person B, they have advantages that B doesn't, doesn't mean they don't face racism, or that the racism they face is less- recognizing that someone else has got it harder than you doesn't make your experiences null, it just makes you mature, or empathetic. I tried not to use the word "privilege" since you seem to dislike it.

Also I can't speak for anyone else, but I think games of Oppression Olympics are fucking dumb and I'd never say it's "harder" to be bisexual than gay. That said, it really fucking hurts to have to be afraid to participate in queer communities because of the [fairly high] chance of me being written off because I "have some straight privilege" or what the fuck ever.

I agree. But I find it odd that you seem to imply that I'm the one playing Oppression Olympics here. The original anon on this thread is talking about certain bisexuals that specifically say they are more oppressed than everybody else, that is playing oppression olympics, not me pointing out that they're wrong. If you aren't one of those people then we are on the same side.

You wouldn't be pretending to be heterosexual in that case, you'd be in a heterosexual relationship, and you'd be happy, that's all.

But, even as a bisexual woman in a relationship with a man, I'm still bisexual. This isn't the case for everyone, but it is for me and plenty of other bi people; we don't want to lose our identities based on who we date. I actually am a bisexual woman in a relationship with a man. However, I am very vocal about the fact that I'm not straight. My sexuality is a part of me, and I don't want people assuming I'm something that I'm not. Of course, I'm also in an open relationship and am allowed to have girlfriends, so that does color the situation a bit, but still. Actually, one thing that regularly offends quite a few bisexuals is when people try to define us by our relationships. "Oh, you're in a heterosexual relationship right now, so the fact that you're bi doesn't matter". That sort of thing. It's really offensive.

As to the overall matter of the advantages bisexuals have, yeah, sure, if someone is bisexual and they happen to fall for someone of the 'opposite' gender, it's generally easier for them. However, being attacked for having that advantage is really fucking hurtful, and it happens a lot. Honestly I think that happens way more often than bi people claiming to be "more oppressed than anyone else". Actually, I've never fucking seen anyone actually say that. I've just seen accusations of it, like the OP of this thread. And honestly? Though I disagree with it, I completely understand the sentiment. Gays and lesbians have to be afraid of whether they'll be accepted among hetero circles, but bisexuals also have to deal with that unless they opt to feign heterosexuality (and self-denial isn't fun, seriously), and then on top of that they have to worry about being ostracized from queer communities due to biphobic prejudices.

It looks to me like you're trying to say it's not as bad to be bisexual, and that...really isn't true. Also I don't take kindly to any sort of defense of biphobia, which again seems to be something you're supporting, hence me engaging you here. I apologize if I misinterpreted your argument, though.

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