[ SECRET POST #2693 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2693 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 03 pages, 058 secrets from Secret Submission Post #385.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 0 - too big ], [ 1 - repeat ], [ 1 - blank image ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[(Anonymous)]

IA

Expecting mentally ill people to control themselves is stupid. Not being able to control your thoughts and behavior regardless of your will is the definition of mental illness. Everyone experiences some problems in social interaction, it's only when these problems are completely beyond their control, and it's unlikely to ever change, that we call them a mental illness.

Of course there will be times when mentally ill people will use their illness as an excuse even in situations where it doesn't really apply. Of course nobody should be forced to deal with this. But the correct response to that is explain to the ill person what they're doing wrong, and ignoring them until they correct their behavior, not expecting them to control themselves, and certainly not mocking them.

[diet_poison]

Expecting mentally ill people to control themselves is stupid.

I can't tell if you're being serious or sarcastic, based on the rest of your comment. I mean, really??

[(Anonymous)]

Yes, really. As a person who's psychotic, when I'm having an episode it doesn't matter that people tell me demons aren't real, my roomamate isn't trying to kill me and aliens aren't trying to intercept my thoughts. I can't reason my symptoms away if I try hard enough. The same goes for any mental illness.

[sarillia]

I don't know about every mental illness. I've had delusions like that that I couldn't shake off, but I've also had intrusive thoughts that I really was able to reason myself out of. In fact a lot of therapy is built around learning to rewrite those thoughts.

[(Anonymous)]

The reason therapy is so expensive and done by qualified professionals is because it's not so easy that a person can do it all by themselves in a manner of minutes if they so wish. And that's how long a typical conversation on the internet takes before dissolving into a wank, because someone whose illness impairs their social skills says something stupid and is unable to understand what it was.

[sarillia]

I never said it wasn't a difficult and long process. But you claimed it was impossible for all mental illnesses (if you are the anon I replied to).

[(Anonymous)]

Not in a matter of minutes, but it's certainly possible to do a lot of it on your own. I couldn't afford therapy for a long time, so I just got myself a few books on cognitive behavioral therapy and started teaching myself how to do it to help my OCD. You essentially have to learn to rewire your thought patterns, and it isn't easy and it takes a long time, but it is possible to do it yourself.

[feotakahari]

Any website needs to have some behavior rules to prevent abuse, and it needs to ban people who can't follow the rules. It sucks if you're not in a mental state to follow them, but there's really no way around it. (I remember a poster on TV Tropes who was really nice, really likable, and occasionally had episodes where she would PM someone and tell her she wanted to skin her and wear her. She wound up being banned for the sake of the person she was PMing.)

[(Anonymous)]

As I said in my original comment, no one should be forced to deal with mentally ill people causing trouble. I'm only opposed to mocking them, or telling them that they're awful people and should learn to control themselves, when it's clear that they can't. Banning is the best solution.

[(Anonymous)]

No, not just any mental illness. You're describing a pretty severe one.

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, that's why when you have a mental illness that interferes with your ability to function to that extent, you need to seek treatment for it.

It's not that I expect all people with severely impairing mental illnesses to seek treatment. But if someone has a mental illness that severely impairs their ability to interact with others in the form of them actively causing harm to other people, and they also aren't seeking treatment (whether by choice or as an effect of their illness), then I'm sure as heck going to try to put as much distance between me and that person as possible. And if the person makes it impossible for me to gain that distance then I would seek help from people who can make them do so (i.e. the authorities).

[(Anonymous)]

That may be true, but do you know what I do when my thought patterns go off the deep end?

GET OFF THE INTERNET!

Because I know I'm not rational and I'll just make an ass of myself. THAT is taking control.

Expecting mentally ill people to control themselves is stupid.

I don't think asking someone to try and mitigate the effects of their condition on others is stupid. If someone has no interest in even trying to do so, that's on them. (And this is from someone known to openly say "I know this isn't rational or logical, but this is how I feel right now." Those who know me, know what that means and can choose to stay or go.)

Control isn't an all or nothing thing.

[diet_poison]

How is that even a little bit comparable to, say, Asperger's???

[(Anonymous)]

Expecting mentally ill people to control themselves is stupid.

Yeah, NO.

Expecting other people to treat others with a basic level of respect is not unreasonable. I am a mentally ill person myself, and I would never, EVER use my mental illness to manipulate or hurt someone. There are, undoubtedbly, times when I am in danger of hurting myself, but even then, I have a modicum of control over my own actions. I take responsibility for myself and my actions. If I make a mistake, and unintentionally hurt someone, I want to know so I don't repeat that in future.

Some people DO have issues with social interaction, yes, but they should still be taught how to interact with other people respectfully. If they don't know these things, their life will be much, much more difficult. And there may be times their behaviour is hard for others to deal with - but even then, there is still a line between "this behaviour is difficult" and "this behaviour is bullying and abusive."

[(Anonymous)]

No broader than your brush painting ASD and psychosis as pretty much the same thing.

[(Anonymous)]

Except that she didn't do that? If I say that oranges and apples are both examples of fruit, I'm not saying that they're the same thing.

My goodness, you are on a hair trigger for taking offense.

[(Anonymous)]

Maybe you wouldn't use your illness as an excuse to hurt others, but what about people whose illness is practically defined by hurting others - like sociopaths or sexual predators?

What about people who hurt others indirectly or unintentionally - people with anger issues, impulse control issues, addicts, compulsive liars, etc?

What about people who, through no fault of their own and despite their best efforts, are incapable of communicating in a way neurotypical people call "respectful"?

Self-control is a luxury for a lot of people. Not everyone is aware enough of their own behavior to know what needs to be stopped, not everyone is in a place where they can be receptive to suggestions to stop, and not everyone is in a place where they can put in the HARD work to change their behavior or work through it or whatever phrase you want to use. And if they are in a place where they're ready, willing, and able to change? It's HARD work. People struggle for YEARS to gain clarity and insight into why they do what they do - and this isn't limited to the mentally ill or non-neurotypical.

[(Anonymous)]

Well no, obviously you can't expect a pathological sexual predator or something to control their behavior when it stems from a chemical inability to stop hurting people. That's why they need to be locked up for the safety of others, not "ignored" like the sorts of behaviors op of the thread is talking about. That kind of shit can't be ignored and some of the stuff you've listed can ruin other peoples' lives.

Whereas someone with psychotic symptoms is usually a danger mostly just to themselves.

[diet_poison]

The problem with that line of thinking is that people have a right not to be hurt by the kinds of behaviors you've listed. If they cannot learn to control themselves, they should be confined.

Mostly here though we're talking about milder stuff, I think - stuff that people can learn to control. It's understandable that it may be really hard for some people, but they aren't entitled to using other people as a verbal or emotional punching bag while they figure it out. If someone is getting a lot of negative feedback from their online peers for being a bully, manipulative, or otherwise hurtful, they need to log off for a little while and seek help.