[ SECRET POST #1799 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #1799 ⌋


Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.


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Notes:

IP logging is on because of the youtube redirects.

Secrets Left to Post: 06 pages, 144 secrets from Secret Submission Post #257.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 1 2 - broken links ], [ 1 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 0 - repeats ]
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments and concerns should go here.

Comments

[fscom.livejournal.com]

10. http://i40.tinypic.com/5xucu1.jpg

[(Anonymous)]

tracking this thread in hopes of wank.

[(Anonymous)]

I really can't stand copyright disclaimers before fics, they're always so inane and every single one says the same thing. "I don't own the shows, maybe one day, but I do own the dvds lol!!" They just seem pointless?

[wolfiemon.livejournal.com]

This. uuugh.

[hoggle2807.livejournal.com]

I hate the ones that get all cutesy with it. "Teehee! I don't own them, but if I did..oh the things we would do!" And lately somebody's been making sure to tell us that the character's belong to the source-creators "gray matter" or somesuch. Ugh. Irritating.

[(Anonymous)]

I think they used to be necessary, back in the olden days when fanfics were hosted on their own websites, before ff.net was a thing, but after e-mailing lists were the fanfiction go to, but they remain out of tradition.

They are still required at sites like adultfanfiction.net, and some others, if I remember correctly.

[zamkenobi.livejournal.com]

I don't rage, but I do tend to laugh when I see "no copyright intended," for the reason you listed. It seems funny to me that people think that writing that counts as a disclaimer when they upload copyrighted material onto youtube

[kamikazemusume.livejournal.com]

I know this isn't the case on every single site that hosts fics or other fan works, but some actually require you to put some kind of disclaimer (e.g. the "I do not own the rights to these characters/this series", "no copyright infringement intended", etc), or they won't allow you to post your work. I know at least AdultFanFiction.net is like that, and possibly others, though honestly, I rarely venture outside the realms of AFF.net, LJ, and The Pit (better known as FanFiction.net) for fiction and deviantART and Pixiv for art.

[gethenian.livejournal.com]

Wouldn't fanfiction be protected as fair use under US law as long as you're neither claiming anyone else's work to be your own nor redistributing the source material verbatim?

[rosehiptea.livejournal.com]

I'll admit to using it, though it's because I always took it meaning "I know I wrote this story but I'm damn well not saying this fandom is mine." As opposed to "This isn't copyright infringement because I just said so."

Which, OK, is still pretty stupid because nobody's going to think I wrote Harry Potter anyway, so I do see your point.

[countess-k.livejournal.com]

I can see you have absolutely NO PROBLEM with fanwork. None whatsoever.

[kallanda-lee.livejournal.com]

You missed the point. The point is that you are pointing out that you're not making money, and do not own the franchise, and hope this will cover your ass enough to not get sued - so you can continue contributing to fandom.

[(Anonymous)]

It seriously started back in the Dark Ages of internet fandom. Until then, zines had been fairly 'underground' but nobody knew what was going to happen with fic on the web, and there were no test cases of whether the legal owners of intellectual property were going to stop with Cease and Desist orders or flat out sue you for plagiarizing.

So it's an announcement that you aren't claiming you created these characters and plot-points. Maybe it didn't have a lot of legal standing, but it made a lot of us feel a little better that we blatantly put it out there that we were *just writing fic* and not claiming 'omghee I made up Captain Kirk all by myself!'

OP

[(Anonymous)]

I mentioned this in some replies, but forget to ID myself as OP. I just want to clear up one thing:

Disclaimers in general don't bother me. I understand why they are used. It's just that particular phrase that sets me on edge.

[(Anonymous)]

This is why I don't do disclaimers anymore unless it's required by the site I'm posting on.

I mean, what's the point. Obviously I'm not trying to claim it as my own, it's highly unlikely I'm trying to make money off it, and if anyone ever felt it was necessary to actually come after me for writing fanworks and infringing on copyright the disclaimer isn't going to do shit for me.

[dgcatanisiri.livejournal.com]

A lot of time, I think, it's more out of hedging your bets than anything about believing that they actually have some sort of claim - a better safe than sorry attitude that says 'hey, I'm just borrowing the toys in the sandbox for a little while, they'll be back there when I'm done, I'm not trying to profit off of someone else's work' and that sort of thing. It's making an announcement about how they're doing it out of love of the source material, and not that they want to step on toes.

[(Anonymous)]

Hm... I guess the phrase is kind of silly, but what I disagree with is your statement that fanfiction automatically is copyright infringement. I'm not an expert on copyright law, but as I understand it, there's a lot of grey area in the copyright law, and if you picked a bunch of fics at random, I think the law would find that the most or all of them don't violate copyright. Copyright = the right to copy, plus similar related rights. Works in their entirety are copyrighted, not ideas. So taking a passage from a book and using it in your fic would be copyright infringement. Putting up an episode of a TV show for download would be copyright infringement. But taking the characters from a movie and writing an original story about it using your own words is not necessarily copyright infringement. It could get into illegal territory, but for the vast majority of fanfiction, there is no money involved, and the fic author is not claiming to be the original writer or author, nor is the fic similar enough to the original work for it to be considered derivative, I think. (I'm not entirely sure, but my understanding is that derivative would be like taking a passage from a book and cutting out some sentences and changing up the names and pretending it's a new work, or mixing clips from several movies and calling it original.) In such a case, I think it would be really hard for an author to argue that their work's copyright was infringed upon, or even to care, since it's not like they're losing money from fanfiction being written for their work.

[techno4tomcats.livejournal.com]

Copyright is such a sticky messy issue and I'm really shy to upload any art without a disclaimer.

That said the actual statement 'infringement not intended' is kinda stupid for various reasons. But I DO think it's important for fanartists and writers to mention their work is fan work and state they do not claim ownership of X series in whatever wording works best.

It may not mean anything legally (I assume nothing people say means piddley squat in court), but some people may assume you ARE claiming ownership or may want to know what kind of fan work it is, if it is on a general website.

[nyxelestia.livejournal.com]

This is why I don't bother with disclaimers - if I get sued for fanfic, then a sentence at the top of the fic isn't really going to save my ass; either I prove my case independently of no copyright infringement intended and no profits made, or I don't, but that disclaimer won't really help if the person suing me really wants to cut my throat and has the lawyer to back it up.

The likelihood of an individual getting sued over fanfic is extremely minuscule. Far more likely, if an author/owner/whatever decides they don't like fanfic of their creation, they'll go and sue the websites hosting the fanfic, not the authors of said fanfic.

[(Anonymous)]

lol i agree totally
"x not intended." *does x*

[semi-subtle.livejournal.com]

What I hate far, far more is when people post art of their OCs or origific or something of the kind and say "so-and-so or such-and-such idea is (c) me" for EVERY FUCKING THING THEY'VE EVER CONCEIVED OF.

Uh. Calm the fuck down. No one wants your OC or your stupid ideas.

[kryptoncat.livejournal.com]

This is completely and utterly off topic, but... I really like that font. You made simplicity good-looking.

[(Anonymous)]

Responding to lots of the stuff in this thread.

After a ton of research, I don't think that fanfiction violates copyright. Additionally, I think the assertion that it does, by various groups and people is antithetical to the original purpose of copyright. That said, I still think disclaimers are a good idea, but the OP is right. The phrase, "No coypright infringement intended," is stupid. It offers you no legal protection.

I tend to list the creators of characters and universes that I'm playing with, and often add that I believe my fanwork to be compliant with all copyright law. Sure, saying that doesn't make it true either, but at least my position is out there. It's not some vague statement that really I didn't mean to infringe on your copyright. It's the assertion that what I'm doing is legal.

There's not a lot of good case history for the issue, because this type of copyright issue doesn't usually end up going through the author, or even the website the fic was posted to. It goes through the webhosts, who are by and large, trying to do the expedient thing, which means responding to cease & desist notices with ordering people to take down the potentially infringing material or their website will be shut down. We won't get good case law until someone starts threatening a webhost who will force them to take it to court.

[mikkeneko.livejournal.com]

Okay, a couple thoughts here.

1 - I'm getting really tired of people who know nothing of law, who seem to be convinced that fanwork (specifically fanfic) is illegal and lolz fans just don't want to admit it. It's not illegal and it's not copyright infringement unless some profit is being made by it or it could otherwise be seen in a way that could reduce the original owner's body of ownership and royalty. There are actual cases where that's happened* and they've all been very high profile and uproarious and completely different from the sort of situation you're describing here. So, in short, you're wrong and your rage is misdirected.

2 - I also get annoyed by people who get cutesy or funny with the disclaimers. At that point it stops being a legal anything and merely becomes a fandom in-joke the author shares with their readers. The only disclaimers that count are "I do not own or presume to own [original show,] and no profit is being made off this work." Everything else is just self-gratification.

3 - Personally I haven't bothered with adding legal disclaimers to my work for years, largely because of #1.

*for examples, see: the contested ownership of the story cowritten with Marion Zimmer Bradley, and/or the attempted publishing of a Harry Potter trivia book that was both 90% copy/pasted from the original text and would also infringe on a similar book the author intended to put out; in both cases ownership and publishing rights and thus profit were at stake.

[netbug009.livejournal.com]

I'm even more specific with my pet peeve pertaining to this; it only bugs me when it's on YouTube and they act like YT is some sort of antagonist because they have taken episodes/their AMVs down.

It's not your properly, video makers. I love when we're allowed to use it by nice copyright holders who realize fanwork expands the fanbase and usually does more good for a franchise than bad, but they're not idiots or evilz if they decide to claim their work. Sheesh.