[ SECRET POST #2076 ]

[case]

⌈ Secret Post #2076 ⌋

Warning: Some secrets are NOT worksafe and may contain SPOILERS.

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Notes:

Secrets Left to Post: 5 pages, 108 secrets from Secret Submission Post #297.
Secrets Not Posted: [ 0 - broken links ], [ 0 - not!secrets ], [ 0 - not!fandom ], [ 1 - too big ], [ 1 2 3 4 - repeat ].
Current Secret Submissions Post: here.
Suggestions, comments, and concerns should go here.

Comments

[firstmoonie]

Arakawa based characterizations on real life, and personally that's why FMA characters are special for me.

[nachtmusik]

Thank you much! ♥

[gobbledigook]

But yeah, the thing is, sure, bisexuals can end up in a happy relationship with someone of the 'opposite' gender* and be fine and dandy and accepted by society. But the thing is, that is at the cost of our identities. Most of us don't want to pretend to be straight, and the assumption that we do is upsetting.

You wouldn't be pretending to be heterosexual in that case, you'd be in a heterosexual relationship, and you'd be happy, that's all. Bisexual people who are in gay relationships aren't pretending to be gay either, but if they choose to stay in a gay relationship they will face more hardships than they would if they were into a hetero one. That chance of blending in while still being relatively happy is something gay people don't have. They either become miserable by denying themselves or they accept themselves at the risk of everyone around them making them miserable. Do you see what I mean?

Hm. But right in my previous post I said that I think bisexual people are also affected by homophobia. Thing is, people in heterosexual relationships are safer from homophobia than people in gay relationships are (unless it's an atypical kind of relationship, but I'm going for something more general here). It's not an attack on you personally when someone points out that you have advantages that they don't. It's like if person A is mixed race and has lighter skin than person B, they have advantages that B doesn't, doesn't mean they don't face racism, or that the racism they face is less- recognizing that someone else has got it harder than you doesn't make your experiences null, it just makes you mature, or empathetic. I tried not to use the word "privilege" since you seem to dislike it.

Also I can't speak for anyone else, but I think games of Oppression Olympics are fucking dumb and I'd never say it's "harder" to be bisexual than gay. That said, it really fucking hurts to have to be afraid to participate in queer communities because of the [fairly high] chance of me being written off because I "have some straight privilege" or what the fuck ever.

I agree. But I find it odd that you seem to imply that I'm the one playing Oppression Olympics here. The original anon on this thread is talking about certain bisexuals that specifically say they are more oppressed than everybody else, that is playing oppression olympics, not me pointing out that they're wrong. If you aren't one of those people then we are on the same side.

[nursethalia]

I'm pretty sure all of us do.

[nursethalia]

What if the pairing doesn't specify what month the romance is taking place? Or this code for something else? Considering that all these characters shown are younger girls with older men I'm wondering if it's the latter... *Googles* Okay, ignore me. At least I learned something new today.

Re: American animals and a very familiar spider!

[(Anonymous)]

Awww, voles! Microtines are just little fuzzy balls of cute--but the spider could give them a run for their money.

Re: Leaks

[(Anonymous)]

If you watch the episodes, than you're watching TV. You're just not watching it on a television.

[lentils]

I actually kind of enjoyed this stupid movie (hey, two friends and I went to see it and it only cost $5 in total so I don't feel that bad) and Richard was the best part.

[nachtmusik]

You wouldn't be pretending to be heterosexual in that case, you'd be in a heterosexual relationship, and you'd be happy, that's all.

But, even as a bisexual woman in a relationship with a man, I'm still bisexual. This isn't the case for everyone, but it is for me and plenty of other bi people; we don't want to lose our identities based on who we date. I actually am a bisexual woman in a relationship with a man. However, I am very vocal about the fact that I'm not straight. My sexuality is a part of me, and I don't want people assuming I'm something that I'm not. Of course, I'm also in an open relationship and am allowed to have girlfriends, so that does color the situation a bit, but still. Actually, one thing that regularly offends quite a few bisexuals is when people try to define us by our relationships. "Oh, you're in a heterosexual relationship right now, so the fact that you're bi doesn't matter". That sort of thing. It's really offensive.

As to the overall matter of the advantages bisexuals have, yeah, sure, if someone is bisexual and they happen to fall for someone of the 'opposite' gender, it's generally easier for them. However, being attacked for having that advantage is really fucking hurtful, and it happens a lot. Honestly I think that happens way more often than bi people claiming to be "more oppressed than anyone else". Actually, I've never fucking seen anyone actually say that. I've just seen accusations of it, like the OP of this thread. And honestly? Though I disagree with it, I completely understand the sentiment. Gays and lesbians have to be afraid of whether they'll be accepted among hetero circles, but bisexuals also have to deal with that unless they opt to feign heterosexuality (and self-denial isn't fun, seriously), and then on top of that they have to worry about being ostracized from queer communities due to biphobic prejudices.

It looks to me like you're trying to say it's not as bad to be bisexual, and that...really isn't true. Also I don't take kindly to any sort of defense of biphobia, which again seems to be something you're supporting, hence me engaging you here. I apologize if I misinterpreted your argument, though.

[dragonimp]

For me the issue was never whether her actions or characterization were realistic. I think they are justifiable and realistic. The issue is I don't like what it says about her character. I don't like the "the person I love is dead and I have lost the will to live" sort of character. I don't like the "now I will sit here and wait to be killed" sort of character. And I don't think that sort of obsessive devotion makes for a healthy relationship.

Re: Have you ever been really excited for something

[intrigueing]

Ahhhhh...that makes way more sense. Yeah, the whole "omg tying up all loose ends" thing really bugged me in the epilogue too.

[cleverthylacine]

I'm not picking on you, but you've just hit on what annoys me so much about the insistence on shipping Kanaya with guys that almost always comes FROM guys. (And I AM bisexual, so no erasure bullshit please.)

If Kanaya looked like Shannon Beiste on Glee or like Equius Zahhak with boobs in a dress, the straight male contingent of the fandom wouldn't be HALF so insistent on involving her with men in fic and art. But because she's a lipstick lesbian and they all think she's a hottie, they can't stand the idea of her reserving her nook and bulge and buckets for GIRLS ONLY.

Not every hot girl wants the penis. Please deal with this fact, men of Homestuck fandom. I don't get into ship wars because it's a waste of my time and I would never get up in your face about this, but I absolutely refuse to read or look at Kanaya getting red or black and down and dirty with men. Come on! There are 2 cherubs, 24 trolls, and 8 human kids. You can let Kanaya be queer.

And we do know some trolls are queer by troll standards--demiromantic, aromantic, and so on...just because it was part of Kankri's rant. (It may be masochistic of me but I really would like to be able to read the whole thing!) Bisexual is most common among them, as hetero is among humans, but there are some outliers.

[cleverthylacine]

Oh man I thought I was the only one.

I like Twilight, and am forever irritated by people who tell me in the same breath that Edward Cullen (whose behaviour is problematic, but also makes sense for a guy born in 1900 with his brain chemistry permanently stuck in late adolescence) is a horrible creepy stalker but Rory is a lovely perfect man whom Amy doesn't appreciate enough. They are both weird and possessive, but I mind it more in Rory who's supposed to be a modern individual and who isn't being driven by various atavistic nonhuman instincts thither and yon and has supposedly grown up--in fact is often treated as the only grownup in that relationship.

[teckie]

Yes to the first, not pathetic on the second. But totally a sap for Amy. XD

[gobbledigook]

I know. I said in my previous post that bisexuals in gay relationships aren't pretending to be gay.

As to the overall matter of the advantages bisexuals have, yeah, sure, if someone is bisexual and they happen to fall for someone of the 'opposite' gender, it's generally easier for them. However, being attacked for having that advantage is really fucking hurtful, and it happens a lot.

People pointing out you have an advantage is not an attack. In this specific case it only comes out as a way to keep certain bisexuals from playing oppression olympics.

Honestly I think that happens way more often than bi people claiming to be "more oppressed than anyone else". Actually, I've never fucking seen anyone actually say that. I've just seen accusations of it, like the OP of this thread.

I can't validate or invalidate your own experience on this but in my case that's usually how it goes, which is why I decided to say something. Most of the times it just goes without challenge because if anyone says anything they get dogpiled.
As for seeing examples, on this very thread, besides the OP, there's another anon that also sees it happening often:

http://fandomsecrets.dreamwidth.org/670751.html?thread=581616415#cmt581616415

And another anon that seems to genuinely think bisexuals are more oppressed than everybody else, bonus smug attitude and "heterophobia":

http://fandomsecrets.dreamwidth.org/670751.html?thread=581651487#cmt581651487

If I were to reduce my argument in order to make it easier to understand I'd say that couples that are perceived by society as heterosexual are privileged in comparison to queer couples. Doesn't mean they don't face their hardships, that their experiences as bisexuals don't count or that they're bad people. It only means that when they say they are more discriminated than gay people are, they are wrong.

[(Anonymous)]

Hogwarts AU fics are practically the only high school AU fics I can tolerate. Write your fic, OP.

[diet_poison]

Why don't you write it??

I might! But I've been swamped for time lately and fanfiction just isn't at the top of my priority list. ;-;

[nachtmusik]

My issue here is that what I usually see is gays and lesbians playing Oppression Olympics with this. "Oh, you could date someone of the opposite sex, so you aren't as oppressed as me, so you don't really belong in queer spaces!" Yeah. That's what I see. All the goddamn time. So is it any wonder that quite a few bisexuals feel completely left out of everything? We have a slight advantage that may or may not actually benefit us in the end, and are often alienated from queer spaces because of it.

[(Anonymous)]

this

[(Anonymous)]

Video games from Japan, I assume female fandom.

[(Anonymous)]

Ze Eenglish language, she is a funny thing, no?

[(Anonymous)]

I just wrote a massive HP fic with my friend and posted it. There are 2 more on the way and 2 more in the pipeline... HP fandom is not dead.

[gobbledigook]

Well, going back and forth with "it's like this for me" isn't going to get anywhere. I did state my point of view and showed you that other people also feel that way, and if you see that as oppression olympics there's nothing I can do.

For what it's worth I don't think it's fair that bisexuals are apparently alienated from queer spaces, and I'm willing to bet most of the people have a bigger problem with the attitude of oppression elitism some bisexuals have than the bisexuals themselves.

[nachtmusik]

Honestly, though, I have to question why you even care that bisexuals have some alleged advantage. That is almost always a launch point for the "your problems aren't as bad as mine weh weh" sort of thing. That's also why I brought up Oppression Olympics; that's...what worrying about that is. Who fucking cares if bisexuals have the possibility of some level of acceptance, at the cost of our identities, that may or may not even come to be and thus may not ever benefit us? Bisexuals are still oppressed. Who the fuck cares if we're "less" oppressed? Mostly just people who want to alienate us or trivialize our problems because we're not "oppressed enough".

Also seriously, I question this idea of bisexuals "playing Oppression Olympics". Because being upset about the aforementioned attitudes some gays and lesbians have is not Oppression Olympics. It's indignation at being treated like shit by people who should understand. Maybe you have actually run into a bisexual or two playing the "weh weh more oppressed than you" card, I don't know, but I wouldn't be surprised if that wasn't actually the case. Just sayin'.